Matrix with nerds and nerd friends. Signal with friends and family.
Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
311–320 of 972 posts
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#312Have to keep in mind that WhatsApp's customer base is not the western world, but mainly growing economies like India and African countries. WhatsApp recently rolled out Payments feature in India. In fact WhatsApp for Business is pretty good for SME to conduct business in India. Some of the shops that I went to India has paperless receipts and digital payments thru WhatsApp and UPI. They ask your WhatsApp number by de…
WhatsApp is basically a given in Europe, they want to become like WeChat in China but for outside the Chinese firewall.
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#313WhatsApp is bad. They are owned by a data collection company notorious for gross privacy violations. Both the client apps and the server are completely closed source, which means either could be spying on you without any way to know. They do claim to implement the secure Signal Protocol, but how do you verify end to end encryption without seeing source code, anyway?
Telegram is a perfectly adequate choice. The user experience is similar to WhatsApp. It does practice some dark patterns - end to end encryption is only available in "secret chats" and calls, which means all other messages you send are readable by anyone with a warrant - and has had some high-profile exploits over the years, but the current iteration of its cryptographic protocol has been proved secure [1] (disclaimer: the paper claiming so came out within the last month, and I haven't found any discussion or review). All of the client apps are open source. The server is not, but if the clients are properly encrypting messages, that shouldn't be a security concern (To my knowledge. I am not a cryptographer).
Discord is community-oriented. It's primarily based around "guilds" (commonly referred to as servers) that function similar to Slack workspaces. A robust role-based permission systems has made it pretty much the de facto standard for large communities wanting a real-time discussion platform (think subreddits, Discourse forums, etc). They have some top-of-the-line engineers who sometimes publish cool blog posts about their ridiculously performant clients [2]. Nonetheless, nothing is encrypted, they aren't open-source, and they have an unclear monetization model [3].
Signal is designed, intentionally or not, as a SMS replacement. It's build around one on one and small group messages. Their encryption is strong, independently verified, and enabled by default (Signal falls back to SMS for others who don't use it). Think iMessage, but open-source and secure. You'll see HN complain about its UI from time to time, but really, it's quite good. It's also extremely easy to convince friends and family to switch to.
Matrix aims to be to real time chat what email is for asynchronous communication. Rather than a service, it's a standard, which means you'll see swaths of clients strewn about GitHub and other websites, the most feature complete of which is Element [4]. In practice (or for the time being), Matrix is just better IRC. VoIP and video calls are somewhat hodge-poged into the spec, but do work well, and encryption by default has been rolling out over the past year. Direct messaging, group chats, and communities are also all supported, although the latter suffers from the IRC-like limitation of only one "channel" per server.
I know nothing about Threema or Viber, sorry.
[1]: https://arxiv.org/abs/2012.03141
[2]: https://blog.discord.com/why-discord-is-switching-from-go-to...
[3]: https://cadence.moe/blog/2020-06-06-why-you-shouldnt-trust-d...
[4]: https://element.io/
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#314Where is the "Don't switch" option? Because as much as I hate that Facebook bought them, they're part of what I would call "critical social infrastructure." Asking to leave WhatsApp is like cancelling your contract with your ISP and going offline just because you don't like the company.
Also missing a "I'm not switching because I've never needed to use WhatsApp" option. My social circle has been on Signal for years and WhatsApp never caught on.
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#315Earlier quoted context omitted.
I would personally have a hard time convincing people to switch to Matrix when the Elements UX is so bad and I haven't found any good alternatives.
The clients are Matrix’s limiter right now. I’ve tried multiple and none are polished. Fluffy chat may be the best, but still needs lots of love.
I did find a native macOS Matrix client and quite honestly I'd love to be able to use a native client since all platforms really only have Electron apps. But the macOS client only gets me so far since I also want to use it on my phone.
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#316Because WhatsApp's moat/lock-in-effect is that ~2 bln people use it whilst the second largest listed here, Telegram, has around ~400M.
By this comparison, on average, by removing WA and limiting one's social circle to Telegram, chances are, that you cut ties with 4/5 of your contacts.
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#317Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#318Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#319Telegram is a great IM experience . The client is good, feature set is good, the stickers are amusing (if you're into that kind of thing), the feature set is complete and everything is polished. Telegram is, I think, going to be one of the easier sells if you're trying to convince non-technical users to switch from WhatsApp or FB Messenger. The privacy, security, and governance story is not great though. If you care…
Re: Poll: Switching from WhatsApp
#320WhatsApp has been a more or less indie creation helped to cut cost of text messages to zero. Then it was acquired by FB and is now part of big tech. We all know what this means.
With signal as a notable exception, I doubt that there could ever be a different outcome for any commercial product.
Why is it, that we do not see more competition from non-profits? The tech world has changed so much, that the ideas of the open source/free software movement are not as applicable as they were when Stallman founded GNU. However, with Wikipedia we see a worldwide Top10 site being a non-profit.
So, where are all the Google/Twitter/Facebook competitors funded by contributions of its users? Given how hard and expensive it is to really compete in that space, is the goal unrealistic? Or is it that there are some (hidden) incentives in the game which contradicts that goal? (Other than monetary incentives for the founders)