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How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

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Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#51
post #49
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think immortal is the wrong word here. All organisms die. If it's not aging, then decease and predators will do it.

I'm not aware of a context where immortal refers to organisms that can't be killed by accidents and predators. In mythology and novels alike, vampires, gods, elves, ..., are all called immortal and still can be killed.

It's called Biological Immortality[1] and there are a few examples of animals that are considered immortal.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biological_immortality

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#52
post #44
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think immortal is the wrong word here. All organisms die. If it's not aging, then decease and predators will do it.

Biological immortality is the technical term for organisms which do not die unless killed, or more accurately where rate of mortality from senescence does not increase with chronological age.

I thought the term was negligible senescence?

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#55
Magnificent. The placenta uses a protein named syncytin [1] to attach to the cells of the uterus. This protein is expressed by a retrovirus that was integrated into animal DNA over 100 million years ago.

This reminds me of Lynn Margulis’ discovery that mitochondria and chloroplasts are ancient bacteria incorporated into the cell [2].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syncytin-1

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynn_Margulis#Endosymbiosis_th...

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#56
post #40
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for asking a simple question, but how do we distinguish sexes? If male seahorses can be pregnant, it's obviously not by which sex gives birth.

It’s entirely determined by the gametes. Males produce sperm, females produce eggs.

And the thing that distinguishes eggs from sperm is what? The relative size? (Are there no species where they are roughly the same?) Or that the mitochondria come from the egg?

Edit: Looks like it's merely relative size, and when neither gamete is bigger biologists throw up their hands. Sort of a bummer that there isn't a more robust definition.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isogamy

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#57

Every thing about life is so fascinating. I have always wondered how viruses have persisted for so long if they need a host to survive and it took us millions of years to go from single celled to multicellular. I wish there was a way to know everything and become good at everything. :/

> I wish there was a way to know everything and become good at everything. There must be some way to do it, because I constantly encounter people on the Internet, that know everything, and are good at everything. I can’t get any of them to tell me how they do it, though...

I wouldn't say everything, but I have encountered such people too. Extremely knowledgeable and always curious. It feels as if these guys somehow have more energy to expend than most of us. On the contra, I get burnt-out pretty quickly when I try to push myself beyond an arbitrary threshold which I have never been able to measure.

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#58
post #55

Magnificent. The placenta uses a protein named syncytin [1] to attach to the cells of the uterus. This protein is expressed by a retrovirus that was integrated into animal DNA over 100 million years ago. This reminds me of Lynn Margulis’ discovery that mitochondria and chloroplasts are ancient bacteria incorporated into the cell [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syncytin-1 [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynn_…

I don't recall where I read it but I recall that the nucleus of a cell started out as a captive bacterium.

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#59
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s entirely determined by the gametes. Males produce sperm, females produce eggs.

And the thing that distinguishes eggs from sperm is what? The relative size? (Are there no species where they are roughly the same?) Or that the mitochondria come from the egg? Edit: Looks like it's merely relative size, and when neither gamete is bigger biologists throw up their hands. Sort of a bummer that there isn't a more robust definition. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isogamy

The relative size but also the structure and the process of fertilization. The sperm enters the egg, not the other way around. Mitochondria come from the egg, yes.

Also note that sperm vary in shape. Mammalian sperm have the familiar tadpole shape with a flagellum for swimming. Other species, such as nematodes, have ameboid sperm which move along surfaces rather than swimming freely.

Re: How the placenta evolved from an ancient virus

#60
post #30

It is also being researched how endogenous retroviruses are part of aging. The very rough idea being that at some point long in past a retrovirus became endogenous and provided a pathway for aging increasing the evolutionary rate of that organism, which would then out-compete most of the immortal organisms with time. Something like: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20346965/

That's incredibly interesting! Do you know some (pop)science books that could help learn more about viruses? I found two that sound good from description: "Viruses: A Very Short Introduction" by Dorothy H. Crawford and "A Planet of Viruses" by Carl Zimmer. Would you recommend any of these or something else?
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