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Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

asahilinux.org

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Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#201

Post by esclerofilo »

spurdoman77 wrote: post #120
corytheboyd wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yeah pine64! But how does it compare to the M1 performance? I should have explicitly stated that these ideal computers would match or outperform Apple’s hardware, since that is very much the case with current intel based MacBooks

Pinebook does the typical "as cheap and low-end as possible" linux stuff. I would love to see ARM linux hardware manufacturer who would aim to create a high-end fanless powerhorse like mac mini.

Minor correction: The mac mini isn't fanless

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#202

Post by jd3 »

This is really cool!

Does anyone know why a similar project doesn't exist currently using the open source distribution of Apple's Darwin operating system? It has always seemed strange to me that their open source BSD OS does not have an official distribution channel with a built in package manager like macports, pkg-src, gentoo prefix, etc.

OpenDarwin and PureDarwin existed for awhile, but seem to have both been abandoned now.

X11 (including thousands of open source and graphical x11 programs), plan9port, and other open source software projects already compile and run fine on macOS, so this has always seemed like something that _should_ be possible but has never gained traction due to what I guess is lack of documentation and Apple's lackluster open source website.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#203

Post by sneak »

machello13 wrote: post #50
ciwolsey wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see nothing wrong with any of these speculations. If you or Apple don't like speculation the answer is for them to communicate their intention.

They've plenty communicated their intention to not turn the Mac into the iPhone/iPad. And besides which, it would be a disastrous product strategy to do that, from a company that's absolutely top-of-the-ball when it comes to product strategy.

There are entitlements on macOS that are not provided outside of the App Store, such as NetworkExtension API VPNs.

There is also no way to turn off the persistent, hardware-serial-number-based APNS connection to Apple, tracking the system from IP to IP whenever it's on, even when no apps are running.

You also can't wipe and restore a mac with filevault without an online reactivation from Apple, even if you have local bootable install media.

There are several concrete, technical advances toward the thing they are claiming not to be doing. macOS is indeed becoming more like iOS every release. It's not just unfounded paranoia.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#204

Post by gorkish »

Apple needs to give a little here.

I think it's patently ridiculous that we have to enlist the assistance of console hackers in order to have a chance at porting the most used operating system in the entire world to run on hardware that in all likelihood already happily runs it inside of Apple's labs.

> In particular, we will be reverse engineering the Apple GPU architecture and developing an open source driver for it.

This is all a noble goal, but I can't see this as being anything other than a complete and total non-starter with zero cooperation from Apple. After the street cred of getting a marginally usable OS up and running evaporates, why continue to take the effort of great engineers and waste it developing an ecosystem that doesn't care? It makes no sense to me.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#205

Post by comex »

marmaduke wrote: post #101
pkulak wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mac hardware is just so damn good though. And everywhere. I absolutely agree with what you're saying... but man, Linux working well on an M1 Mac would be my ideal machine.

Would it be materially different than Linux running in a VM on m1? Because you can have that now

GPU support would make a big difference.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#206

Post by michaelmrose »

pricci wrote: post #186
monocasa wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PS3, and supposedly that was because some jurisdictions treated game consoles and computers differently for import tariffs (computers being cheaper to import), but those jurisdictions changed to not having a distinction. Agreed with the underlying point you're making though. They allow this because it aligns with their current strategic objectives, and changes to those objectives can be arbitrary and capricious, at l…

I remember it was because geohot "jailbreaked" the PS3 using the Linux capabilities to some extent. But I could be wrong.

I actually think other os got canned before the jailbreak. If I recall correctly it provided extra incentive.

They may have wanted to make it harder to jailbreak. Another argument is that they weren't profitable to sell as computers but largely become profitable via the money they made off games sold for the platform including money paid by game developers.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#207

Post by takeiteasyy »

actuator wrote: post #40

It seems so amazing to me that Microsoft saw the ARM opportunity with Windows RT, released 8 years back but somehow managed to not succeed with a stellar ARM laptop story. Maybe Qualcomm is more to blame here for never progressing as well as Apple has done on chips but maybe the software experience was just not there. We would probably already have good ARM laptops running linux distros if Windows on ARM had taken of…

My hypothesis for why it failed is because the only real value Windows provides is with legacy Windows applications, which their ARM platform did not provide (at least to a comparible level).

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#208

Post by nanagojo »

turbinerneiter wrote: post #87
ravi-delia wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On any other apple computer I'd agree, but I really want some of that sweet ARM magic.

Just wait for SiFive and RISC-V, that's going to be the revolution I'll join :)

They simply don't have the funds or fab to compete with M1

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#209

Post by boogies »

jd3 wrote: post #202

This is really cool! Does anyone know why a similar project doesn't exist currently using the open source distribution of Apple's Darwin operating system? It has always seemed strange to me that their open source BSD OS does not have an official distribution channel with a built in package manager like macports, pkg-src, gentoo prefix, etc. OpenDarwin and PureDarwin existed for awhile, but seem to have both been aban…

The world’s largest corporation is happy to accept gratis open source labor, but they’re rather actively antagonistic to Free/Libre software (eg. trying to eradicate strong copyleft from macOS, not only shipping ancient bash, etc. but prohibiting third parties from shipping it through the App Store without mandatory DRM). The lackluster support for open source distributions is virtually certainly intentional. The other BSDs are the closest you’ll get.

Re: Asahi Linux: Linux on Apple Silicon project

#210

Post by nvarsj »

rightisleft wrote: post #94
pkulak wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mac hardware is just so damn good though. And everywhere. I absolutely agree with what you're saying... but man, Linux working well on an M1 Mac would be my ideal machine.

is it? my 2016 macbook was the worst apple product i've ever owned...

Yeah of course it is! Don't you know how the Cult of Apple works? We proclaim it is, so it is.

Edit: Whoops, I broke the first rule of the Cult... Here come the downvotes.

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