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I am lonely will anyone speak to me

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Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#131

Post by Jon_Lowtek »

bentlloyd1 wrote: post #77
underseacables wrote: post #64

In my humble opinion, it is critical that we become OK with being alone. I believe that only when we are comfortable by ourselves, can we truly ever be happy with someone else.

I disagree with this mindset. Humans are a social species and require some sort of interaction to thrive. Perpetuating this idea of going at it alone is a problem in modern society imo. This is coming from a pretty extreme introvert.

i think you over-radicalize the opinion you are responding to. "being comfortable with oneself" is not the same thing as "going at it alone". While I agree with you that radical individualism is a troublesome ideology, I also agree that it is wise to be comfortable with oneself, both while alone, and when in company.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#132

Post by throwaway3699 »

scythe wrote: post #116
BurningFrog wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's pretty simple: Women look to men for strength, so showing weakness takes a man out of consideration as a partner.

He wasn't trying to date her.

That doesn't necessarily have anything to do with dating, either.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#133

Post by fuckminster_b »

closeparen wrote: post #128
underseacables wrote: post #64

In my humble opinion, it is critical that we become OK with being alone. I believe that only when we are comfortable by ourselves, can we truly ever be happy with someone else.

This is is a popular thing to say on the internet, and surely there's a kernel of truth, but it lacks nuance. Living without a family or community is like running a marathon. There's something virtuous about learning to say "fuck you" to your brain's self-protection circuitry, experiencing the hell it raises, and staying the course. Any healthy person could manage it. Many would be better off for the conditioning and…

Truth be told, chances are pretty high that being alone can work out for someone hanging out in a place like HN. For the grand majority of people, being alone is a drain on their wellbeing, no matter how well they may adjust to it.

But for a select few, being alone can be a preferred state over having to share a place and time. If you can embrace the fact that you are different than most (and fuck them!) and if you can make your alone time fulfilling, you may be one of those lucky few who don't need company to recharge your 'battery'.

A pretty sure tell is when you actually consider socializing a drain.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#134

Post by mapme »

closeparen wrote: post #120
cubano wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like what in life that's worth a shit don't take some effort? Being lonely sucks yeah...but take at least a bit of responsibility for it and realize that people make major changes in their lives every-damn-day. Heroin addicts get clean EVERYDAY...you think being lonely is worse than kicking that shit? Guess what...you're wrong if you do. Take small steps. Smile more. Be interested in others. You can do it for sure.

>Smile more No one should be seeing an uncovered face until the whole world is vaccinated.

You can smile over zoom :)

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#135

Post by newsbinator »

roflc0ptic wrote: post #86
Pfhreak wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed. Complaining is one thing, sure, but expressing a wide range of emotions (including healthy expressions of sadness, frustration, fear, etc.) is considered pretty positive and good by the women I know. Crying is important, normal, and healthy.

There actually is research about men and women both turning away from men who are seeking emotional support. College age researchees, so YMMV. Research is referenced in Terrence real’s “I don’t want to talk about it.” Basically you have to learn to express emotions in the right way, and to the right people, at the right time. I had to train my therapist girlfriend not to freak out when I have strong, negative feeling…

Mine is not a valid HN comment because I have nothing to add other than saying thanks for encapsulating this- I've experienced the same and wondered if I was the outlier.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#136

Post by mnsc »

roflc0ptic wrote: post #86
Pfhreak wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed. Complaining is one thing, sure, but expressing a wide range of emotions (including healthy expressions of sadness, frustration, fear, etc.) is considered pretty positive and good by the women I know. Crying is important, normal, and healthy.

There actually is research about men and women both turning away from men who are seeking emotional support. College age researchees, so YMMV. Research is referenced in Terrence real’s “I don’t want to talk about it.” Basically you have to learn to express emotions in the right way, and to the right people, at the right time. I had to train my therapist girlfriend not to freak out when I have strong, negative feeling…

>Basically you have to learn to express emotions in the right way, and to the right people, at the right time.

> a huge part of it was just a fundamental misread

I think you are on to something in the first part about you yourself learning stuff but in the last part you just put the burden of those around you.

My take is that men in general lack training in identifying/naming their own feelings/emotions. Then when you are experiencing some tough negative emotions you can't express/talk about them and then your secondary emotions come in from this frustration. What emotion that is is personal but often men will go to anger, "it's think it's this thing that is causing me pain so that thing is bad/stupid/wrong" but all along it was your own feelings coming from your own unmet needs that you could have handled yourself if you just had could have named and reasoned about them.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#137

Post by pschimi »

nowherebeen wrote: post #48
DoreenMichele wrote: post #37

I've studied social/psychological stuff, spent a lot of years suicidal and spent a number of years homeless which was incredibly socially isolating and even negatively impacted how people interacted with me online. Some thoughts (intended as a buffet to choose from if it strikes your fancy, not a prescription for "the right way" to do anything at all): 1. It's usually not actually helpful to signal that you are despe…

> Signaling desperation attracts predators far more often than it attracts real friends. This is something so obvious but has eluded me until you said it. I have seen this happen in work settings and have never been able to pinpoint it. Thanks!

It's a problem many women face. Scenario: late night walk home in a quiet street. Suddenly, a group of young males, obviously drunk, approaches from the front.

Most women instinctively cross over to the other side of the road, equating distance with safety, without realizing that this is signaling just the kind of vulnerability that makes them appear as potential prey to a certain type of male predator in the first place.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#138

Post by watermelon59 »

Geminidog wrote: post #122
pksebben wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are very broad generalizations, and not at all representative of anything like a truth. I concede that it may have been true in your experiences, but it's a fairly toxic pattern to make categorical statements about "what women want" or "what men are like" when the spread of human character is so broad. Let's try not to limit what's possible by inflicting on the world what we expect. Specifically, statements lik…

>but it's a fairly toxic pattern to make categorical statements about "what women want" or "what men are like" when the spread of human character is so broad. It depends on your definition of toxic and your definition of truth. The belief that categorical statements have zero relevance in this world is an ideal that is just too unlikely to be true. Broad statements can be made about both men and women. For example Wo…

You are probably not wrong in your statements about biology influencing behavior, but in my opinion that kind of thinking ignores the fact that we humans are capable of recognizing all of that and acting upon it. We do not have to succumb to our natural baggage.

The problem with making and accepting general statements about the behavior of men and women is that it leads to an incredibly exclusionary society where only the "normal" (per those general statements) can find companionship and happiness.

I'm a man, and I'm straight, but I'm very, very gender-nonconforming. I don't have your typical male traits of being aggressive and competitive and assertive. I'm shy, I'm very sensitive, and my interests are much more "feminine" per our society's norms than "masculine." I'm not handy, I don't go around fixing things in the house. I don't take big risks. I much prefer the cooperative and nourishing work style of women than the competitiveness of men. Perhaps the only typically male thing I have going is being rather strong, thanks to Olympic weightlifting... which I'm attracted to a million times more because of the graceful and aesthetic nature of the movements than any sort of muscle building benefits it might have for my looks. Getting stronger and looking better as a result of practicing it is just a nice side effect.

I struggled with all of that for a long time. I used to be a fan of Jordan Peterson & co, who promote the sort of ideas found in your post. I fell into a really deep depression because I just could not be a socially acceptable Manly Man (TM), unless I was willing to undergo a ridiculous amount of self-inflicted stress to conform to a model of being that's just not who I am.

When my therapist finally convinced me to stop listening to Peterson's ideas, things started getting better. Suddenly, there were possibilities. There are all sorts of people in the world. We're not bound to live strictly by natural laws, because we think and make judgements on people at a much higher level of cognition than simple physical traits.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#139

Post by watermelon59 »

pksebben wrote: post #101
BurningFrog wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's pretty simple: Women look to men for strength, so showing weakness takes a man out of consideration as a partner.

These are very broad generalizations, and not at all representative of anything like a truth. I concede that it may have been true in your experiences, but it's a fairly toxic pattern to make categorical statements about "what women want" or "what men are like" when the spread of human character is so broad. Let's try not to limit what's possible by inflicting on the world what we expect. Specifically, statements lik…

A number of folks in this thread seem to listen to Jordan Peterson's ideas, which seem smart and reasonable but are actually very toxic. See my reply to the post you were replying to.

Thank you for being a voice of reason.

Re: I am lonely will anyone speak to me

#140

Post by AnthonyMouse »

brundolf wrote: post #127
theboat wrote: post #76

Sometimes it feels like we're in the midst of a loneliness epidemic, created or exacerbated by technology like the internet. But the data doesn't actually line up with that belief: https://ourworldindata.org/loneliness-epidemic It looks like we are generally as lonely as we were throughout the 20th century. Perhaps that's a sign the internet hasn't yet lived up to its promise as the great unifier. The fact that the g…

Totally speculating, but I think cultural loneliness may be rooted in individualism. Which isn't to say individualism is intrinsically bad, but one of its trade-offs is the devaluation of relationships, especially ones you haven't gone out of your way to initiate and maintain. Which is to say: the problem was never a lack of communication channels.

I think there's something to what you're saying but the terms are slightly wrong. Individualism is ordinarily set in opposition to collectivism, but it's the bastardization of both that have created the problem.

On the one hand, social clubs have been evaporating. Bowling leagues, rotary clubs, ham radio clubs etc. They're fading, and this predates 2020. These things are compatible with individualism -- it's freedom of association. But in practice people aren't doing them as much anymore.

On the other hand, the bureaucratization of social assistance. If you need help you don't go to people in your community who already know your face and the specifics of your plight, you fill out a form on a computer and some algorithm decides whether you get a supermarket gift card.

Both of these trends are isolating but it's not because of where we put the trade off between individualism and collectivism, it's because we're doing both of them poorly.

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