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Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

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Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#211

Post by rasz »

knazarov wrote: post #70

There is actually a good webcam now. It's AverMedia PW513. It has a Sony Exmor 4K sensor, and generally favorable reviews.

Review with actual footage made with this webcam https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5MfenW7EqA

Wow, it sure does look like quality webcam, the only thing someone might miss is custom lens with fancy bokeh.

Edit: Watched to the end, it does fake 1080@60 by upscaling 720 :( So still a good choice if 1 you dont need 60Hz 2 dont mind being scammed by a Taiwanese company.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#212

Post by adrian_b »

Aldipower wrote: post #115
muro wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dell sells good monitors.

I fell into this trap. Now I own a very bad Dell monitor. :(

Dell sells some good monitors.

Unfortunately, you must select carefully any monitor that you purchase, and the cheapest models are unlikely to be good choices.

I am using 2 good Dell 4k monitors. One is 1-year old (U2720Q), but the other (UP2414Q) is more than 5-year old and it works as well as in the first day.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#213

Post by rasz »

coldtea wrote: post #208
piranha wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you can get cheap china-knockoffs for about £12, I don't know how good they are. They are so-so. Well, they are much-much better than any webcam, of course, but 1080p is almost the same as 720p on them. So as a budget thingie it'll work, but Elgato's adapter is much better, of course.

> So as a budget thingie it'll work, but Elgato's adapter is much better, of course. I saw a video where Elgato Camlink opened up, is just a chinese card repackaged with the Elgato logo, 99% similar internally to the cheap knockoffs. Can't find it again to link it to...

https://wiki.apertus.org/index.php/Elgato_CAM_LINK_4K

8 layer pcb with custom fpga hardware, doesnt look all that cheap chinese knockoff to me

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#214

Post by jimktrains2 »

This is a little off-topic, but a little tangential. Why do so many people insist on doing video chats? Regardless of camera quality, you're going to come in as a blocky and stuttery mess to most people anyway.

Audio-only has worked really well for my team for a few years now (my team is all remote all thr time), so it's always jaring when interfacing with the rest of the company and having people pop up with video.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#215

Post by coldtea »

gambiting wrote: post #193
coldtea wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But...that is 4K. It's what 4K is defined as, exactly 2x 1080p resolution in each dimension. That's irrelevant though, except if we're talking about consuming movies fullscreen. For a monitor I don't want 4K, I want insivible pixels at viewing distances, so hi-dpi. I would also prefer no scaling for assets that are bitmap in nature. This ideally means pixel doubling (less cpu/gpu demanding and less fuzzy than fract…

I just completely don't understand your point. There's no misleading advertising here - the resolution is exactly as promised ,at the size promised....what's the problem? If the resolution isn't high enough for you....then buy one where it is? There are 5K monitors out there, maybe even 8K? Or just get a 4K one but in a smaller size? I'm so confused by your comment.

>I just completely don't understand your point. There's no misleading advertising here - the resolution is exactly as promised ,at the size promised....what's the problem?

That would be relevant is my problem was false promises or misleading advertising.

But my problem is not

(a) "Monitors say they are 4K and they are not"

but:

(b) "Most monitors out there are BS-4K, but for the best quality/viewing comfort at their 27" and above diagonal they should rather be 5K, but most manufactures like Dell aren't bothered to produce at such a resolution and the few that do have prices to the skies".

>There are 5K monitors out there, maybe even 8K? Or just get a 4K one but in a smaller size?

Perhaps you've skiped through the thread?

My comment responds to (and agrees with) the sub-thread started by a parent commenter writing:

"Dell used to have good offerings, but all they seem to push now is the same 27” not-quite-4K 3,840 x 2,160 panels everybody else does.".

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#216

Post by jcims »

dmitri1981 wrote: post #150
jcims wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want something with some depth of field.

Given my limited understanding of photography that is not really possible with small sensor sizes. Phones can achieve that using computational photography, but I don't think it's possible using optics on webcams.

I think you're 100% correct (minus some weird lab-grade setup or software-base DoF)

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#217

Post by pembrook »

Joeri wrote: post #168
pembrook wrote: post #40

The reason you can’t buy a good webcam is the same reason you can’t buy a high quality monitor outside of LG’s unreliable apple collab. The lazy conglomerates who sell these peripherals often don’t actually produce the parts in them. They simply rebrand commodity cameras and IPS panels in a crap plastic housing and slap their logo on it. Then they give the product a hilariously user-hostile product name, like “PQS GR…

I think it’s more of a “the market won’t pay for quality” problem. People won’t pay thousands of euros for a good monitor, so manufacturers have to slap together the parts available in bulk in order to reach price points people will pay. The LG 5K is a good example, because it is clearly compromised to reach a somewhat reasonable price point. From what I can tell the monitor market mostly exists to cater to the gener…

I don’t think that’s it.

Apple is the most valuable company on earth right now, entirely due to their thesis that people will pay for quality hardware.

The “creator” market is much more profitable than the gamer market where kids only have as much as mom will allow them to spend (vs The tech workers, coders, designers, youtubers, etc that need high quality displays to make a living).

It’s why Apple is able to get insane 50% margins in many products. It’s crazy to me that the big Asian manufacturers don’t see the market opportunity in catering to this crowd.

In their minds you’re either an office drone using excel or a gamer who wants neon lights. Both of which are market segments with terrible margins.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#218

Post by lmilcin »

cookieswumchorr wrote: post #74
lmilcin wrote: post #41

If you are looking here to improve your webcam because you started to do remote work, don't. First try to improve lighting and audio. Any camera will look bad in bad lighting. It is always better to first improve your lighting before you invest in a new camera. Use high CRI lightbulbs and ensure even source color temperature in your room (ie. all lightbulbs should be emitting same color temperature). Audio is also ve…

exactly, audio is the most important. Nobody needs to see your unshaven sleepy quarantine face in 4K. But if they can't hear you, or there is a lot of noise, the meeting is ruined

Actually, nobody will ever see your face in 4k because none of the platforms that are used for this will ever transmit video at that resolution. Most cap at 1080p with a very heavy compression.

Also understand that real time compression is different from offline compression. To compress well it requires a huge amount of CPU. Real time compression results in higher bandwidth for the same image quality but more typically less quality for the same bandwidth.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#219

Post by ktpsns »

fluffy87 wrote: post #112
mattowen_uk wrote: post #20

I've also investigated this quite deeply. As I'm sure most of us know, the main problems with 'webcams', either the built-in ones or USB ones that you perch on top of your monitor, are the lens size, and the CCD/CMOS image sensor size. Manufacturers spouting specs like '4k' are deliberately misleading the public if the sensor and/or the lens aren't also upgraded. The only cost-viable methods to get 'broadcast quality…

I hooked a gopro this way. Their new drivers support using them as Webcams on macos and windows. Beer Webcam I’ve ever had.

Is this related to newer firmware or so? Because I have a gopro and the usb stream quality is only very low, compared to the HD recording facilities of these devices. If you browse the web for this, you will find (again, as in the threads here) the recommendation to use a HDMI-to-USB converter to capture the high quality HDMI stream a gopro can emit.

Re: Why can’t you buy a good webcam?

#220

Post by gaudat »

tilolebo wrote: post #158
gaudat wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tip: try to find out what panel the monitor you are buying has. Then look the panel up in a database like panelook.com. This way you can get the specifications without any marketing bullshit. It also works the other way round. Find a panel that is good enough for your eyes, then see if there's a mass marketed display with that panel. If you are adventurous, you can grab "DIY" or "assembled" monitors with the panels o…

Isn't it so that monitors or laptops under the same model sometimes use different panels?

Yes. Consider most people only care about the resolution, sometimes manufacturers substitute a lower cost panel that is inferior in say, gamut or response time.
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