LOL
Voat Is Shutting Down
341–350 of 671 posts
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#342Earlier quoted context omitted.
The “people get more conservative as they get older” idea is somewhat of a myth. My family and family friends who were free love hippies in the 1960s and 1970s are Trump haters on Facebook today. To give some more solid data than people in my circle of friends: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidentia... This is the demographics for the 1984 election, the one where Reagan wiped Mondale out. Among…
All that shows to me is youth is liberal, which no one was denying? I'd be happy for enough for the general population to be more liberal leaning, but I can't say I'm seeing evidence of it outside of urban areas ?
The youth in the 1984 Reagan-Mondale election was not liberal (nor were they liberal in 1988, nor that much liberal than voters in general in 1992, etc.), so youth being liberal is not a function of one’s age as much as it’s a function of the generation one has been born in to.
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#343Earlier quoted context omitted.
A huge problem, which is the cause of this far more than "free speech" ever was, roots in these platforms optimizing for engagement. And then vacuous controversy maximizes engagement so you're really optimizing for controversy, which is a dumpster fire. But separating the combatants doesn't just stop the algorithmically-promoted unintelligible flame wars. It stops the debate entirely. You lose the ability to even enc…
Pragmatically speaking, that will happen anyway. I’m not gonna use any platform that allows me to encounter Nazis. Voilà: the debate is stopped entirely, even though the platform has done nothing to stop it. And on that topic, do we really need to debate Nazis? Like, are we so committed to the idea of moral relativism that we can’t draw some lines? Because frankly, I have zero interest in debating with anyone whether…
Coming into contact with bad ideas is the risk we take to participate in any conversation.
Every time people forget, the outcome is some horrible event like genocide.
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#344Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly this. Folks can rant about free speech all they want, but no sane person would actually want to experience it. I support your right to speak, but doesn’t mean I want to listen to you. IMO the only parts of the internet that should be absolutely required to allow unfiltered (legal, protected) speech, should be ISP’s, and maybe datacenters that rent out physical rack space. Everyone else should absolutely consi…
> Folks can rant about free speech all they want, but no sane person would actually want to experience it. Always remember that "free speech" is 100% about the right to say what you want and not be prosecuted for it . It has never, ever been about the social consequences of any particular one person's speech. Insulting your boss and getting fired isn't an abridgement of free speech, neither is getting banned from the…
This is the canonical meme of free speech, but there's a corollary that is becoming increasingly relevant. People who repeat what you just wrote usually seem to ignore it: If every arena where people actually meet is privately owned, and all of these places agree on what ideas are valid topics of discussion, the effect on society will largely be the same as if a state actor suppressed free speech.
We're not quite there as a society, but we are moving in that direction. Some of the biggest public arenas are close enough that it is a problem. As a current example, consider if Facebook, Twitter and reddit all agree that any discussion asking critial questions regarding transgender issues are grounds for expulsion. If this happens, there will be valuable discussions that don't happen, and society will be worse off for it. There will be people who make life-changing mistakes because they didn't have access to a viewpoint that catalyzed an insight that was important for them.
We're not quite there yet. But there are numerous incidents that make me worried that this trend will leave us with a society that's net worse off. Or moves towards violent conflict as the suppressing the free exchange of ideas has economic consequences where those with social access to free speech arenas get better opportunities, leaving the rest without even the possibility of engaging.
You see the latter being alluded to when investors on Twitter or elsewhere state that there are many factually true insights about startups that they would never state outside of a close circle of acquaintances, out of a legitimate worry that it would incite a Twitter mob and cause serious personal consequences. Everyone outside of their own sphere of influence are worse off for not being able to share the knowledge. Yet another wedge increasing the wealth disparity, and more fuel for the anger that comes along with it.
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#345Earlier quoted context omitted.
Society has a left-leaning tinge. Especially society in the age range that reddit caters to. There's no grand conspiracy. Right politics are wildly unpopular with young to middle-age people.
That's true. Younger people seem to lean left. As they grow older, a lot of them start to lean conservative. My hypothesis is that when they are young and underdeveloped, they have incomplete understanding of the world, are prone to believing in unrealistic utopian ideas, and hence are easy to manipulate. No wonder, the leftists want the voting age to be lowered even further. As they grow older and wiser, they see it…
[Citation needed]
Please compare https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_United_States_presidentia... and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_United_States_presidentia...
Observe: The 1984 youth voted conservative. The 2004 youth voted liberal. And, oh, the 2020 youth voted even more liberal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidentia...
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#346Earlier quoted context omitted.
> So the answer has to be to stop the witch hunts in the places where everybody else already is. Got to be honest, bro, I don't really care to sacrifice for "the good of society" or whatever. If you make a website where some dude is going to post anti-Semitic shit everywhere and someone else is going to have to politely explain that Jewish lizard people are not conspiring to elect a Black woman as President then sure…
Yes, but there is some middle ground between antisemitism and following what mainstream loves the a given point of time. And right now if someone dares to stick outside mainstream views this is considered hate speech, anti-XXX, etc. Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport…
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Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#347Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can you provide an example of what you perceive to be "left wing extremism"?
“Me-first capitalists who think you can separate society from business are going to be the first people lined up against the wall and shot in the revolution,” he tweeted. “I'll happily provide video commentary.”[0] - Dick Costolo, former Twitter CEO [0] https://www.forbes.com/sites/abrambrown/2020/10/01/some-busi...
Context: he's not saying he'll start a revolution, he's saying one is coming regardless. And he doesn't want to be shot as a rich person. Maybe he also doesn't like how tech tends to ignore the consequences of the decisions they make.
Bad example of leftism run amok and off target
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#348Voat was founded as a neutral free-speech platform. After alt-right extremists were booted off reddit, they found a new home there. The site was bombarded by /pol/ chan culture, and after that nobody else of other political persuasions really wanted to join. Kind of like that "paradox of intolerance" meme. Free speech platforms usually end up becoming extremist platforms. I remember going on voat a couple years ago a…
Linked post references red pilling and 4chan, celebrates being hated by people, talks about how great their terrible user base is, and mentions Christian shit multiple times.
Gives me the impression that it was always intended to be populated by the types of people that populate it.
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#349Most of the original Voat groups were groups that has been kicked off of Reddit, but then people there made groups that corresponded to groups that were still on Reddit, like /v/science and /v/movies. Reading those is quite an experience. On /v/science right now there is a submission about dark matter and MOND [1], which was also discussed today on HN [2]. The title of the Voat submission will give you a good idea of…
Question is where they will end up now that this forum is dead. They will find another one.
Re: Voat Is Shutting Down
#350Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, but there is some middle ground between antisemitism and following what mainstream loves the a given point of time. And right now if someone dares to stick outside mainstream views this is considered hate speech, anti-XXX, etc. Can we discuss if overweight people should pay more for sits in a plane? Can we discuss if a trans male who identifies herself to be a woman should be allowed to take part in female sport…
It’s tiring to have to repeat that you’re proposing debating the legitimacy of the humanity of certain people as though it merited debate.
I find these types of strawman confusing.
It's obvious to anyone who reads them that it doesn't even slightly relate to what anyone here has said (not letting someone participate in sporting events where they have a biological advantage is not exactly calling them pigs) but people post them anyway.
Is there some sort of costly signalling of membership of some social group (woke group?) going on?