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Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

latimes.com

91–100 of 130 posts

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#91
post #11

Sounds like the Dreamliner is the only plane designed to avoid this problem. Oddly the article hardly mentions Airbus, so it isn't clear to what degree their planes suffer this problem. And I wonder why European regulators aren't addressing this issue (which seems implied by the article).

There are several examples of Airbus bleed events in the article if you read the whole thing.

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#92
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US needs a more substantial train system. Sleeper cars are refreshing and train travel is extremely enjoyable.

Sleeper cars are better than an airplane seat, but I wouldn't call them refreshing. The beds are narrow, firm, heat/AC is a crapshoot, and train noises and movement can keep you awake.

Well they should be at least as good as international first class flights for the part where you're lying down asleep (or trying to sleep).

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#93
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

France is 1/3rd higher, and it's centered in relatively fewer big cities - Paris alone is one quarter of the total population of France - no area in the US comes close. In the US it's worse than the density alone would suggest... because 80% of the country right in the middle geographically has a density that is for all intents and purposes zero.

You don't think there are France-sized regions in the US that have greater-than-French density? Why don't those regions have these trains if density is the only problem?

France: Pop 67,153,000, Area 247,368 sq mi

California: Pop 39,512,223, Area 163,696 sq mi

Population density is about the same. 270 vs 240 people per sq mi.

Also running rail through flat low density area's tends to be cheap.

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#94
post #6

If I recall correctly the 787 bypasses the use of bleed air and similar systems by using electrical power instead to pressurize the cabin. That comes with its own set of interesting issues but I wonder if you could get some useful data from the fact that these events shouldn't occur on that plane.

I've loved the 787 every time I've flown it, which is probably 30+ times, predicated entirely on the air + lighting (though this could just be confirmation bias).

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#95
The article has pretty poor reporting. I checked the first couple of examples they gave:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/american-airlines-jet-suffers-fume...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/2019/02/26/ala...

In both cases only the pilots/crew had issues, none of the passengers. In one case it was a "dirty sock" smell. If it was a bleed air problem, it would have affected passengers as well.

A lot of research has been done, and there isn't actually any evidence showing that bleed air causes any health problems:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerotoxic_syndrome#Research

Obviously there are some cases where the seals do break, and there is actual smoke in the cabin, but that is not what the majority of these cases are referring to.

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#96
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

France is 1/3rd higher, and it's centered in relatively fewer big cities - Paris alone is one quarter of the total population of France - no area in the US comes close. In the US it's worse than the density alone would suggest... because 80% of the country right in the middle geographically has a density that is for all intents and purposes zero.

You don't think there are France-sized regions in the US that have greater-than-French density? Why don't those regions have these trains if density is the only problem?

[deleted]

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can only agree that it's nauseating. One time on a trip from Copenhagen to Munich it was so unbearable that I had to throw up. I've told about a dozen friends about this when I got home. While all of them found it very unpleasant, only one other person had to be sick.

I feel a million times healthier after losing my airport ramp job earlier this year.

Have you heard anything about any of your coworkers having similar experiences?

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#99
post #83
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We travel around 300 miles pretty regularly to visit family. Over the years we’ve tried almost every form of transportation: train, renting a car, flying, dirt cheap buses, very fancy buses. Bang for the buck, I’d say our preference became car, train, fancy bus, flying, bad bus. They all pretty much take the same time, door to door, because the airports are not particularly accessible from our starting point and dest…

Is this in the US? I've taken fancy buses like you describe in Taiwan, but I didn't know it was a thing in the US.

Yep! In the Northeast / New England. They’re a dying breed I think, but there are still some around.

Re: Toxic fumes seep into the air you breathe on planes

#100
post #78
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s basically a greyhound bus with 1/2 the seats, a complimentary hot meal, functional air conditioning, and comfortable chairs. They charge a premium, but you bring as many bags as you like and the pickup locations are usually less chaotic (a hotel rather than a regional mass transit center). They still suffer from traffic and the movement of the vehicle (trains are way better in this dimension). They’re kind of li…

Well... umm.. 300 miles is nothing. That's an 8 hour drive max with really bad traffic. That's not really a comparative point.

I think 300 miles is around the inflection point where, if the transportation systems are mature and trafficked enough, it’s hard to nail down an ideal form of travel.

It’s far too long for a taxi, too short for the plane to be obvious, too short for a drive to be overly boring, and too short for a train to be mind-numbing.

Any longer (500+), I think the plane gets the obvious advantage. Any shorter and you wouldn’t consider a plane.

I guess my point is that, at this point in my life, I’d only want to fly to avoid a reliably 6+hour drive (NYC to Augusta ME, for an example). Even then it’s a toss up, depending on how much stuff I’m bringing with me.

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