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Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

bbc.com

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Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#51

Post by ruslanbogan »

distracted_boy wrote: post #49

I just want to highlight the fact that our beloved King made this comment after Mats Melin, leader of the corona commission[1], said that we have failed protecting our elderly which was top priority [2]. The reason for this according to Mats, is because institutional and structural flaws in our geriatric care system. These flaws made it impossible to prepare and manage the pandemic. In addition to these flaws, Mats a…

Yep I live in Skåne and so far people are still happy to get too close to you, don't wear masks in public especially when shopping etc.

My workplace only went full wfh fairly recently with the latest recommendations and still 2 weeks ago people were organising face to face meetings...

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#52

Post by [deleted] »

kzrdude wrote: post #50
leereeves wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even assuming that's true, why should anyone care? Why would someone's family line give their opinion about the coronavirus approach more value than anyone else's?

If you get a job, then it doesn't matter who your family is or if you're the best person for the job(!). If you are lead architect of your company, your job is to give directions etc. Same thing here. Doesn't matter there's others that could replace the king is his job.. he's the current one with that job, so we listen in a way that takes his position into account.

[deleted]

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#53

Post by [deleted] »

kzrdude wrote: post #50
leereeves wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even assuming that's true, why should anyone care? Why would someone's family line give their opinion about the coronavirus approach more value than anyone else's?

If you get a job, then it doesn't matter who your family is or if you're the best person for the job(!). If you are lead architect of your company, your job is to give directions etc. Same thing here. Doesn't matter there's others that could replace the king is his job.. he's the current one with that job, so we listen in a way that takes his position into account.

[deleted]

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#54

Post by 8note »

Svip wrote: post #47
kzrdude wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say that the prime minister is to blame, but the King doesn't say so explicitly, and I point this out because in Sweden's media climate it is for some reason not obvious that the PM is to blame when it all falls short. Because they (the PM and cabinet and the health authority) name their own factors and institutions that they blame. I think the PM should take responsibility, so evidently say you, but unfortunatel…

You are correct, that the King is not explicit in this, he cannot be, he's a constitutional monarch. However, the subtly is thick, and it's not hard to read between the lines, that he is thinking the government of Sweden has failed Sweden. He represents the government of Sweden, and when he is indirectly apologising, that's the statement he is making. And who is liable for the government in the end? Prime Minister Lö…

In Canada and Britain at least the monarch can dosplve the government, and asl the house to form a new government, or call an election

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#55

Post by learc83 »

taeric wrote: post #22
learc83 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're talking about wearing masks in public, it looks like their numbers are low--implying that voluntary compliance isn't working great. For an example, I was driving through rural Alabama, which has a state wide mask mandate, and at every convivence store I stopped in, everyone was masked. Right next door in Georgia, which has the opposite of statewide mask mandate (the governor made local mandates illegal), al…

I haven't seen reporting on their numbers in compliance. The reporting is mostly like this one, focusing on it being voluntary. But then not stating how effective is otherwise it was. They definitely have high numbers of covid. So does most everyone. :(

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1114375/wearing-a-face-m...

As of October--How often have you worn a face mask outside your home to protect yourself or others from coronavirus?

Sweden:

Always------- 4.3%

Not at all-- 76.7%

Spain:

Always------ 95.8%

Not at all-- 0.3%

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#56

Post by learc83 »

0x445442 wrote: post #20
elliekelly wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This Yale study[1] collected data from every county in the US about which restrictions were in place and then tracked how many people got sick. Their data[2] distinguishes between “mask mandate” and a “mask recommendation” and the study author is quoted that the recommendation “doesn’t do anything”. Of course this is all US data so I’m not sure whether or to what extent it would apply to Sweden’s compliance with a ma…

Yep. In order to claim something a failure you need objective criteria to begin with. In terms of Covid those objective criteria never existed and thus the King's claim has as much meaning and weight as mine that Sweden's handling of Covid has been a wild success compared to other countries.

The links in the comment you quoted were evidence in support of mask mandates.

"while many of the available interventions work, mask mandates stand out for their effectiveness and relative lack of economic tradeoffs. “Mandatory mask policies seem to be as effective as policies that have higher costs,” says Tookes."

The article is saying that mandating masks has a positive impact, but recommending them does nothing.

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#57

Post by juancn »

It may be unpopular, but strict lockdowns are untenable in the long term. Living locked down is no life at all, it's just survival.

And I'd rather take my chances if the alternative is perpetual stay at home orders (I'm from Argentina, we spent 9 months in strict lockdown).

At this point, even if the government asks for another lockdown, people are not going to listen.

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#58

Post by leereeves »

kzrdude wrote: post #50
leereeves wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even assuming that's true, why should anyone care? Why would someone's family line give their opinion about the coronavirus approach more value than anyone else's?

If you get a job, then it doesn't matter who your family is or if you're the best person for the job(!). If you are lead architect of your company, your job is to give directions etc. Same thing here. Doesn't matter there's others that could replace the king is his job.. he's the current one with that job, so we listen in a way that takes his position into account.

I confess I come from a country that has so little respect for that job that we abolished the position, and I don't know much about Swedish royalty. What qualifications, knowledge, authority, responsibility are associated with that job? And considering that, how much respect does the job deserve?

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#59

Post by AnimalMuppet »

leereeves wrote: post #48
Svip wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are correct, that the King is not explicit in this, he cannot be, he's a constitutional monarch. However, the subtly is thick, and it's not hard to read between the lines, that he is thinking the government of Sweden has failed Sweden. He represents the government of Sweden, and when he is indirectly apologising, that's the statement he is making. And who is liable for the government in the end? Prime Minister Lö…

Even assuming that's true, why should anyone care? Why would someone's family line give their opinion about the coronavirus approach more value than anyone else's?

I'm not Swedish. I'm from one of those full-on democracies without a monarch, so take this opinion with some salt.

The king isn't an infections disease expert, but he's not an idiot, and he can get any experts he want to tell him what's going on. He's also the one person "in government" who can speak truth about the prime minister without fearing the prime minister's wrath. This lets the king be the one who can say what needs to be said when nobody else will say it.

Re: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'

#60

Post by taeric »

learc83 wrote: post #55
taeric wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't seen reporting on their numbers in compliance. The reporting is mostly like this one, focusing on it being voluntary. But then not stating how effective is otherwise it was. They definitely have high numbers of covid. So does most everyone. :(

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1114375/wearing-a-face-m... As of October--How often have you worn a face mask outside your home to protect yourself or others from coronavirus? Sweden: Always------- 4.3% Not at all-- 76.7% Spain: Always------ 95.8% Not at all-- 0.3%

Thanks! Do we know how accurate those are?

I confess I have stopped driving on these numbers. Seems way more noise then signal. Death rates, for example, at a naive guidance look worse for Spain. Do you also have a good launch point to get caught up on analysts?

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