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More Americans are shoplifting food

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Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#131

Post by onecommentman »

On a more productive note

Stigler diet

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16524061

Subreddit on eating healthy on a cheap budget

https://old.reddit.com/r/EatCheapAndHealthy/

For anyone who put themselves through college, this is much more a shrug than a clarion call for revolution. You can eat cheaply and well with a little effort and creativity. Good training for starting out with a young family, if any of you ever get to that point.

If you haven’t learned to cook, now is a good time. Electric pressure cooker, slow cooker, etc.. Learn to manage your time to make time for meal prep and cooking. Lots of folks take it as a challenge and love to share tips. Shop carefully, share car trips to the cheaper stores, share a Costco membership. The sharing economy isn’t just about obscene IPOs.

As an extreme anchor point for calibration,

.5 kg/day of dried corn to meet RDA calories for adult

http://www.dietandfitnesstoday.com/calories-in-corn.php

->

200 kg/yr to meet RDA calories for year

Corn is 4.30/bu spot price US

A bushel of corn is 25 kg.

So $40/yr to meet caloric requirements for an adult for a year with a car trunk full of dried corn. Some of us have heritages that basically did that.

[Not recommended as a strict diet unless you are a fan of diarrhea, dermatitis, dementia and death. Limewater is your friend. Webpage not for the squeamish...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pellagra]

Now add/substitute soybeans, cabbage, carrots, bulk spices, vitamins. Beans 27 kg for 11.50 nowadays. You are in the

$100-200/yr

range without adverse health effects...maybe healthier than what you are eating now. There were times your ancestors would, and did, kill for the chance at such a diet.

(And the CCP couldn’t even manage that...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine )

Unsheltered? The problem is shelter...basic food for a year is less than three months of utilities, much less rent.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#132

Post by nostromo »

dragonwriter wrote: post #125
nostromo wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Passing a bill you know is dead on arrival is pointless. It's virtue signaling, which is what the house did. Suddenly, after the election, Pelosi is fine passing the same amount she opposed before the election as only half what was necessary. This isn't some right-wing talking point -- Bernie Sanders has sad as much. This was a political game. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/fact-check-did-berni...

> Passing a bill you know is dead on arrival is pointless. Actually, its often a significant part of the political process of building popular and, thereby, legislative support for a solution (which will ultimately often be a compromise from the DOA proposal.) And, in a bicameral legislature, taking up a measure on an issue that is unacceptable in the form the other house passed it in, and amending it to the form tha…

I'm curious if you'd say the same about Republicans repealing Obamacare dozens of times, knowing the bills would go nowhere.

To me it looks like a bad-faith effort and a waste of everyone's time.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#133

Post by jacobolus »

nostromo wrote: post #132
dragonwriter wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Passing a bill you know is dead on arrival is pointless. Actually, its often a significant part of the political process of building popular and, thereby, legislative support for a solution (which will ultimately often be a compromise from the DOA proposal.) And, in a bicameral legislature, taking up a measure on an issue that is unacceptable in the form the other house passed it in, and amending it to the form tha…

I'm curious if you'd say the same about Republicans repealing Obamacare dozens of times, knowing the bills would go nowhere. To me it looks like a bad-faith effort and a waste of everyone's time.

The GOP clearly did want to repeal the ACA, and ultimately would have (questionably, via budget reconciliation, requiring only a simple majority in the Senate) except for the last-minute trick of John McCain. McConnell expected him to vote for repeal, and so allowed other subserviant “moderate” GOP Senators Collins and Murkowski to take the token ‘no’ votes. McCain put in his vote against after there was no way for McConnell to get around it, and the GOP was furious.

After the successful repeal vote in the House in May 2017, the GOP threw big celebratory parties. You can see pictures of representatives smiling and laughing about the prospect of significant numbers of their own constituents losing coverage. They really relished the idea of taking away millions of people’s healthcare, and were profoundly disappointed when it didn’t work out.

As for the dozens of repeal votes while Obama was still in office: those were a quite effective partisan posturing effort. GOP-aligned media spent years on false propaganda about the effects of the ACA, trying to trick a public who largely didn’t understand the law or the healthcare system more generally. (To the point that e.g. in Kentucky people like “Kynect” while “Obamacare” is extremely unpopular, even though they are two names for the same thing.) GOP politicians were electorally very successful campaigning against the ACA while trying to sabotage it in every way they could. Much easier than even pretending to come up with a plan of their own.

Since the GOP Congress during Obama’s second term had no constructive agenda, essentially all of their time was spent on stuff like ACA repeal and Benghazi hearings. You are right that it was a bad-faith effort.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#134

Post by wildleaf »

just-juan-post wrote: post #117
sjg007 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if we open up with no restrictions a lot of people will get very sick very quickly. This will overwhelm hospitals. I mean we are almost at a complete ICU collapse right now already. And a lot of people will die, not just of covid but of other treatable diseases. Not to mention we will run out of PPE and medical supplies. Care will be rationed even more than it is now. More doctors and nurses and respiratory ther…

> Well if we open up with no restrictions a lot of people will get very sick very quickly. This will overwhelm hospitals. The problem is that the public has been hearing this for almost 9 months now and with the exception of a hospital or two it hasn't happened. You can only cry wolf so many times. > I mean we are almost at a complete ICU collapse right now already. Besides a few one off stories could you please prov…

If you have friends or family in the medical field then ask them. There are frequent email updates from hospital leadership on the state of the ICU. In our area doctors are being asked to give up their time off and work unlimited hours (as long as the avg is 80 per week each month). We've had 1 hospital provided N-95 since the beginning of the pandemic. It's filthy and probably ineffective at this point. The last update said there were something like 13 beds remaining.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#135

Post by damnyou »

sanguy wrote: post #65
damnyou wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are starving, stealing food is at the very least perfectly acceptable, and many would say just. I'm not aware of any ethical frameworks, even the most hardcore libertarian ones, which would claim otherwise.

The point is you don't need to steal food to survive. You just need to go to one of food banks or shelters that will help. I volunteer at one of them. Lots of really good down on their luck people; and they are busier that in the past due to COVID job losses. Those stealing are ones with something to prove. We recently had a situation here at the Giant where two adults were stealing ice cream and when the staff tried…

The rich and powerful have lost their moral compass, yes. The way to fix it is for the state to partly seize their wealth and partly deficit spend, and transfer all of it to the poor.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#136

Post by burnthrow »

crx07 wrote: post #120
e40 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the Bay Area there has been a big uptick in thefts and break-ins. My sources are local people and first-hand knowledge (such as seeing broken glass everywhere on the street). I'm in the Oakland area, but friends in other places have experienced and witnessed some crazy things this year. It just blows me away that (part of) Congress has stonewalled any attempts to get people money, given the lockdowns. Reportedly t…

I live in an area elsewhere with essentially zero crime, 24x7 security, cameras, and a well-lit parking garage. Someone stole the catalectic converter off my 2008 Prius last week, a part whose street value is only worth ~$100 and that requires equipment and professional-level skill to steal, likely by someone whose day job generates $70-90/hr. Gotta be pretty damn desperate to risk a felony for a little over an hour'…

I thought it required a hacksaw and a bad drug habit. Impressive they got under a Prius, usually they go for small SUVs for the high clearance.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#137

Post by rhexs »

CharlesW wrote: post #130
just-juan-post wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they don't have the negotiating power to make the GOP budge. A reminder that Nancy Pelosi turned down a $1 trillion+ stimulus offer from the White House. Trump makes $1.8 trillion economic relief offer, but deal with Pelosi remains elusive (Oct 09 2020) https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2020/10/09/trump-ec... Nancy Pelosi blasts the White House's $1.6 trillion stimulus plan, saying it's not even 'half a loaf…

She had to because it was extremely bad, based on an evaluation from the Chairs of the Committees of Jurisdiction. You can read their top-line comments (presented with links to more in-depth analysis) here[1]. [1] https://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/101320

Nothing in that link seems to indicate it was “extremely bad”. Just seems like your typical not enough pork/special interest support red team versus blue team nonsense.

OSHA regulations and “census worker relief” need to be tied into this specific funding bill? Really?

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#138

Post by nobody9999 »

lightgreen wrote: post #63
FnControlOption wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s scary that civil unrest might be exactly what the Republican party wants.

I’m not sure how you attributed it to GOP. It makes zero sense.

>I’m not sure how you attributed it to GOP. It makes zero sense.

Perhaps because the GOP literally called[0] for that? Just a crazy thought.

[0] https://thehill.com/homenews/news/529195-arizona-gop-asks-if...

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#139

Post by eggsmediumrare »

lightgreen wrote: post #17
Serious_Cheese wrote: post #2

>“People will say, ‘I was just hungry.’ And then what do you do?” People stealing food to survive while the super wealthy and rich becoming richer and richer[1]. What a great time to be alive. [1]( https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/11/18/elon... ) EDIT: I don't particularly dislike Elon (the man has done alot of good), but he was the easiest example I could think of. Stock market is a better indicator…

No people are not stealing food to survive. US have food banks and food stamps. People steal because they can. I don’t say people are wealthy or eat enough. I’m saying your statement about survival is untrue, and as any false statement does not help to resolve the issue.

It kinda feels like someone is paying you for this hot take. People needing food banks and food stamps is bad. It's obviously not Yemen bad. This is so obvious it's not really worth mentioning. We have moved on from pointless comparisons of degree to feeling empathy for these people and fear for what this instability will bring about.

Re: More Americans are shoplifting food

#140

Post by dragonwriter »

jacobolus wrote: post #123
nostromo wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think HEALS was milquetoast at $1.1T, you must be pretty upset that Pelosi has now agreed to pass a bill at $0.9T... after months of demanding no less than $3.0T. Gee, I wonder what happened in November for her to change her mind... I'll stop responding now; it's pretty clear a number of folks on HN think that only one party can play political games and this has gotten trite.

> you must be pretty upset that Pelosi has now agreed [...] Nancy Pelosi is surely also upset that we can’t do something more aggressive, but anything at all would be better than nothing (and we might still be stuck with nothing this year). We’re in an extraordinarily severe crisis, and people, small businesses, and state/local governments have been in urgent need of relief for months. Even jaded political veterans e…

> But what we have seen again and again in recent years is that even when we lower the bar down to the floor, they still manage to trip over it.

Correction: slither under it. They don't get over it, even by tripping.

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