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Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

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Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#801

Post by Panini_Jones »

carapace wrote: post #481

San Fransisco isn't part of Silicon Valley. You have to drive for, like, an hour to get to SV from here. SF isn't a nice town. It has nice aspects and places, sure, but it's always been pretty rough here just under the surface. The initial Mission was like a concentration camp for Indians. I just found out that SF State University is built on an Ohlone graveyard. Chinatown was harsh, the population was almost entirel…

> SF isn't a nice town

You make this assertion but back it up by remarking on things from the past. The Mission was a bloodbath for Native Americans one or two centuries ago, yes, but how does that support your initial claim that it currently isn't a nice town? Is that supporting claim really affecting the residents of the mission so greatly right now?

I think San Francisco is a nice town. I hated it before the pandemic because I only stuck to the Mission and SoMA. I started taking walks in Russian Hill, North Beach/Telegraph Hill, the Marina, Ocean Beach, etc. Those are awesome neighborhoods with great people and many things to do. Just like any city in the USA, you get out of it what you put into it.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#802

Post by tempsy »

malandrew wrote: post #797
tempsy wrote: post #790

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure how to respond but no their success comes from being in Silicon Valley at the right time and developing relationships within this ecosystem. So no I disagree that if Rabois was somehow not in Silicon Valley that he’d be just as successful and wealthy as he is now. And I’m speaking about his investments. Cutting a check is not “hard work”. You could argue Musk is different because he’s actually the CEO of…

Why is Silicon Valley where it is other than accident of history? The US government could have made military investments elsewhere and Fairchild Semiconductor would have just as easily been in another state. California and the SF Bay Area doesn't get credit for that. Heck, Silicon Valley was a bunch of fruit orchards for decades. Could have been a different set of fruit orchards in a different state. Had Fairchild be…

I don’t know why this response devolved into defensiveness and personal attacks. I never said I was a founder, though I worked at a startup that Rabois invested in early.

Being an investor is not “hard work” in the same way it is if you’re a founder or employee. Anyone who says it is is lying.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#803

Post by compiler-guy »

throwaway6734 wrote: post #650
nus07 wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree on almost all of your points with a few caveats. - Cars : The Bay Area is very walkable but that’s mainly SF. The tech burbs of Palo Alto , Menlo Park are not super walkable and you are relying on the BART and other public transport . But Covid has destroyed public transport and cuts in funding threaten them further. LGBT : This is not really the 80s and 90s . Most big cities from DC, Atlanta, Austin ,Chicago…

Is there a general belief that San Francisco is a counter cultural place?

At one time, San Francisco was very bohemian and very counter cultural. The Electric KoolAid Acid Test has its genesis in San Francisco. As do the Grateful Dead, the summer of love, and many other parts.

You can still find many vestiges of this, like all the head shops and very non mainstream things in the Haight Ashbury, but the reality is that it is far less of a counter-cultural mecca today than it was fifty, or even twenty, years ago.

The reputation is taking a long time to catch up to that reality though.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#804

Post by CalChris »

bgorman wrote: post #791
CalChris wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a counterfactual. Yeah, maybe Shockley's project happened elsewhere it Silicon Elsewhere could have happened somewhere else. But it didn't happen elsewhere. But you are assuming that it would have catalyzed elsewhere. For example, it could have catalyzed in Murray Hill, New Jersey after the transistor but it didn't. Anyways, people are always leaving the Bay Area. If you came here five years ago, first you wer…

It is interesting how you can gloss over the signifcance of the inventor of the transistor moving to the bay area, and then use the example how his former laboratory in New Jersey failed to commercialize the transistor as an example of how Silicon Valley is uniquely situated to allow innovation to happen. A much more reasonable interpretation is that Shockley was going succeed no matter where he went, not that Silico…

When Shockley moved west in 1956, Stanford Research Park was already 3 years old. Its defense roots predate even that. Shockley wasn't moving to a technological wasteland.

https://steveblank.com/secret-history/

Ames Research Center dates to 1939.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ames_Research_Center

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#805

Post by birdyrooster »

PopeDotNinja wrote: post #764
tempsy wrote: post #727

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This story is insanely misleading though. Everyone here is talking about why the tech elite are leaving due to the quality of life when Keith Rabois specifically has like 3-4 IPOs he was an early investor in going public right now and makes no sense to stay in California in 2021 and pay state capital gains taxes on those sales. Same with Elon Musk and Tesla’s absurd stock price. And probably a lot of other people giv…

I think you’re echoing OP’s point. Some people come to California for opportunity, and when they find enough success, they leave. They’re not CA natives, they’re expats from places with less opportunity and crappier weather. People who want to live in California view the taxes as a cost of enjoying California.

If we want to start getting uppity about who is a Californian native, let's first consider the Muewkma Ohlone people who were decimated and whose lands were stolen by European settlers here in the Bay Area.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#806

Post by malandrew »

tempsy wrote: post #802
malandrew wrote: post #797

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is Silicon Valley where it is other than accident of history? The US government could have made military investments elsewhere and Fairchild Semiconductor would have just as easily been in another state. California and the SF Bay Area doesn't get credit for that. Heck, Silicon Valley was a bunch of fruit orchards for decades. Could have been a different set of fruit orchards in a different state. Had Fairchild be…

I don’t know why this response devolved into defensiveness and personal attacks. I never said I was a founder, though I worked at a startup that Rabois invested in early. Being an investor is not “hard work” in the same way it is if you’re a founder or employee. Anyone who says it is is lying.

Sorry. Your comments came off as personal attacks on Keith and I mirrored your responses.

I've worked heavily with VCs when I was the first employee at a startup that did well for a few rounds and they worked very hard to help us out. The only difference is that they lived better while helping out because they were already wealthy, but they certainly worked hard for us and for their other investments.

You can be fiscally comfortable and still work hard.

Now I'm not defending how much ownership they take relative to what they put in. Both us and our VCs worked hard. They just took a greater chunk of the equity because of the capital provided.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#807

Post by legerdemain »

devtosales wrote: post #777
legerdemain wrote: post #703

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presence, sure. What about legal protections around seemingly trivial daily things like bathroom use? Family planning services focusing on the needs of LGBT families? Doctors who have experience with LGBT patients, whom these patients can trust and talk to candidly? Churches that welcome LGBT members without pressuring them to change fundamental aspects of their lives? Mental health specialists that cater to LGBT nee…

Children don’t have diverse identities. I used to think I was Batman, my mate used to think he was black. Impressionable children are impressionable.

Case in point.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#808

Post by chucky_z »

selimthegrim wrote: post #465
chucky_z wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is legitimately what we're doing. We're bringing in really junior folks and spending years training/improving them. Unfortunately that doesn't help now . I thought it would be easier this year to hire due to COVID and layoffs, but it just hasn't been.

Did you post in Who’s Hiring? :)

The company I work for did. I asked to edit the post to add my specific posting and they said it couldn't be done. It'll be there next month though!

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#809

Post by malandrew »

tempsy wrote: post #799
cltby wrote: post #778

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My comment is a reply to this: "To blast the Bay Area and state which made them rich and then flee before they owe a penny is gross." It's not gross to minimize your obligations towards people who have done nothing for you. Seattle is the relevant counterfactual: flourishing tech scene without the punitive tax burden that we're supposed to believe enabled California's success.

Seattle’s tech scene consists of two giant tech companies that started in the 80s and 90s and the satellite offices of California HQ’d companies. It’s a lot of cogs. There is no comparison when it comes to startups created in, say, the last 10 years or so.

In the earlier days, Silicon Valley also had had satellite offices from some of major tech companies on Route 128. It was the minicomputer that upset this state of affairs.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#810

Post by trentnix »

throwaway201103 wrote: post #667
trentnix wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure it's relevant. It's not as if remote options haven't been available for a long time. The wages in San Francisco aren't determined explicitly by cost-of-living, they are determined by the scarcity of availability of the right resources. Businesses found it necessary to exist in Silicon Valley because it provided certain benefits, and businesses found it necessary to have on-premises employees because it p…

The support for remote has expanded greatly. Zoom isn't perfect, but it's a lot better than a group of people sitting around a speakerphone or a glitchy skype or WebX call trying to work with a remote person. And if everyone was remote, forget about it it was like getting the planets to align for everyone to be in productive remote communication. Remember spending the first 15 minutes of every conference call just ge…

True story, but I feel like that's the fairly distant (in Internet years) past.

I just know that the improved state of affairs has my wife and I dreaming of remote work in a rural area one day soon. Come on Starlink!

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