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Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

businessinsider.com

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Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#671

Post by seppin »

bigyikes wrote: post #13

As it happens, tomorrow I’m putting in my 30-day notice to terminate my lease and leave the Bay. (And I’m paying 2 additional months rent in fees to do so) Not being tied to the office fundamentally changes the calculus of choosing where to live. There just aren’t good reasons to live here anymore for so many of us. Even if you enjoy the area, chances are you can get a better deal by moving just a bit further away. A…

> There just aren’t good reasons to live here anymore for so many of us

The majority of people that say this are also the exact reason why the city is blackhole of culture and fun. You aren't in traffic, you are the traffic.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#672

Post by solidsnack9000 »

mturmon wrote: post #644
rayiner wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Every time someone mentions cheap midwest cities I have to pull up https://crossingenres.com/out-in-the-united-states-where-can ... and see if anything's changed since I last checked. This analysis is shallow and has a thumb on the scale in favor of California. The author says of same-sex marriage: “There is much talk at the federal level by the presumed GOP candidate of creating legislation that would remove this…

> California, by contrast, reacted to an identical court ruling in 2008 by banning same-sex marriage until all such laws were overturned in 2015. This is a cherry-picked example and a bad-faith argument. You're trying to portray the CA Prop 8 battle as demonstrating that CA was/is regressive. It does not show that. It's more accurate to say that there was a national debate going on at the time, and the open-ness of t…

The point that you started out arguing was based on policy, though. Support in San Francisco and West Hollywood does go much, much deeper than it does in Midwest cities -- and much, much deeper than in most cities in California.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#673

Post by mattcaldwell »

nus07 wrote: post #582
rpearl wrote: post #555

Nobody really brings up that the bay area is one of few places in the US where you can live without a car. Really, even compared to other "walkable" cities beyond a select few, similarly expensive places. Nobody really brings up that the bay area has better LGBT and other minority protections than anywhere in the US, either. Every time someone mentions cheap midwest cities I have to pull up https://crossingenres.com/…

I agree on almost all of your points with a few caveats. - Cars : The Bay Area is very walkable but that’s mainly SF. The tech burbs of Palo Alto , Menlo Park are not super walkable and you are relying on the BART and other public transport . But Covid has destroyed public transport and cuts in funding threaten them further. LGBT : This is not really the 80s and 90s . Most big cities from DC, Atlanta, Austin ,Chicago…

Even smaller towns, like Asheville (where I am now), have a huge LGBTQIA+ presence. I moved from DC, which was pretty gay, and I feel like it's even more super gay here.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#674

Post by ahhname »

rpearl wrote: post #555

Nobody really brings up that the bay area is one of few places in the US where you can live without a car. Really, even compared to other "walkable" cities beyond a select few, similarly expensive places. Nobody really brings up that the bay area has better LGBT and other minority protections than anywhere in the US, either. Every time someone mentions cheap midwest cities I have to pull up https://crossingenres.com/…

As a LGBT member in a red state (Florida), the idea that California's protections or perceptions of LGBT people are unique is just absurd. I'm in my early 20's and have never faced any discrimination that would warrant an interaction with the police. Amongst my friends, the police have always been extremely helpful.

The only divide that exists is between cities and rural areas. Virtually every city is going to have a large LGBT population with its own anti-discrimination ordinance and essentially be indistinguishable with SF. From the LGBT rights in Florida wiki:

>In addition, several cities and counties, comprising about 55% of Florida's population, have enacted anti-discrimination ordinances. These include Jacksonville, Miami, Tampa, Orlando, St. Petersburg, and Tallahassee, among others. Conversion therapy is also banned in a number of cities in the state, mainly in the Miami metropolitan area.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Florida

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#675

Post by seppin »

scottlocklin wrote: post #92
kilbuz wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always have to ask, where are you moving and why did you pick it?

I always answer: fuck off; we're full. California, particularly Bay Area California is so ridiculously dysfunctional, the last thing any region needs is their refugees, who will bring with them the problems they're fleeing. Austin for example. Used to be a great place.

> I always answer: fuck off; we're full.

Actually being from SF, I have never once given any transplant any shit (mostly because at any given party I am the only local).

It would never occur to me to be nativist in my own country, how does this shit fly elsewhere?

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#676

Post by babesh »

ericmay wrote: post #482
gabereiser wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. This argument that cheaper workforce is out in the sticks, waiting for “remote work” is a lie corporate America has told to keep people in the office. The truth is, no matter where you are, talent knows what talent is worth. We price accordingly and in the end the market is stable at a certain price level. We’ve been seeing this over the last decade in major US cities competing for SF-level talent. Tech is o…

Thanks, Gabe. And I don't think it's SV -> Rural America exclusively. Many of these jobs will filter back into medium to large sized metros across the country. Places like Columbus, Indianapolis, St Louis, Atlanta, Nashville, etc. . There are scores of talented developers in these areas that would be open to remote work, but not relocation to the major metro areas.

Is this what is actually happening? We should look at the statistics as to where people move to.

From what I can tell, people are actually mostly moving to other tech hubs (but lower priced) and to high end vacation areas. Think Austin, Denver, Park City Utah, Lake Tahoe, etc... The underlying dynamics are still at play (even tech but to a lesser extent).

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#677

Post by ng12 »

spamizbad wrote: post #598
rpearl wrote: post #555

Nobody really brings up that the bay area is one of few places in the US where you can live without a car. Really, even compared to other "walkable" cities beyond a select few, similarly expensive places. Nobody really brings up that the bay area has better LGBT and other minority protections than anywhere in the US, either. Every time someone mentions cheap midwest cities I have to pull up https://crossingenres.com/…

Chicago and NYC do car-free better than the Bay Area, where not owning a car is really only viable in SF and a few small surrounding communities.

And Boston and DC. I wouldn't live in SF without a car unless I was a biking enthusiast.

Also I find that many people who proudly refuse to own a car in SF just end up ubering everywhere.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#678

Post by rpearl »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #634
rpearl wrote: post #555

Nobody really brings up that the bay area is one of few places in the US where you can live without a car. Really, even compared to other "walkable" cities beyond a select few, similarly expensive places. Nobody really brings up that the bay area has better LGBT and other minority protections than anywhere in the US, either. Every time someone mentions cheap midwest cities I have to pull up https://crossingenres.com/…

>Nobody really brings up that the bay area is one of few places in the US where you can live without a car. Not really, not compared to Boston or, particularly, New York.

The rest of that paragraph says: > beyond a select few, similarly expensive places.

Nobody's putting Boston and NYC on the list of cheap places to live, any more than SF.

That said, someone in a different part of this thread brought up Chicago, which seems plausible! Though I haven't been there enough to know if that's true! (Though when I visited, their transit definitely was very good).

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#679

Post by ericmay »

kodah wrote: post #608
ericmay wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, mostly. The bottom is still decently high even in Midwest cities. But if you’re making $140,000 + RSU/Bonus/Etc., someone from somewhere else will do that job remotely for $100,000 easy. But I would characterize this as a wealth distribution, and overall net positive for the country. People who don’t have the opportunities to work at the top companies in the Bay Area or NYC or Boston now have better access.…

Former Texan here! You will not get RSU's or bonuses as an engineer in Texas. You will get cash and insurance. If you doubt me, feel free to go on an interview and ask about those things! I can tell you there's a reason I left Texas and it's because cash doesn't do to your savings what RSU's and bonuses will.

Companies here in Ohio do both RSU and bonuses. Sometimes one or the other, sometimes a mix as part of total compensation.

Re: Tech elites leaving San Francisco threaten Silicon Valley's supremacy

#680

Post by philwelch »

uoaei wrote: post #629
ianmobbs wrote: post #574

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you really saying that it's harder to be a techie than LGBT in San Francisco?

Victimization narratives are intoxicating. A lack of diversity in experiences will lead some down narrow paths.

In principle I agree with you--this is one of the biggest pathologies of our time.
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