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YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

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Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you? Not to over simplify things, but freedom, liberty, and equal treatment were pretty much empty words and applied only to white American men (see: treatment of Native Americans, the Mexican-American war, slaves, and women). Federalists were very clear in their commentary and design of the Constitution that they were in favor of broad federal powers and feared populism and direct democracy. The Bill of Rights wa…

People like yourself that constantly bring up the wrongs of the past and constantly remind people that things were less than perfect in the past constantly don't seem to understand that: * Much like many things society progresses, generally in the western world that progression has tended towards greater liberty (in most respects) of its citizens e.g. Tom Holland (a documentary film maker in the UK) argues the separa…

This is true, but you need to consider the context of the debate. The problem with political discussions is that every person (or every side) is actually debating something else.

That said, there are three common contexts to "bringing up the wrongs of the past:"

1 - It's a counter to traditionalist/revivalist/restorationist sentiment and/or mythology. In this case, the myth is that all freedoms come from and are rooted in the infallible founding. Any change is a corruption or a regression and reduces freedom.

The true history is that abolition happened first in the empire. The moral change which made the term "freedom" applicable in any meaningful sense came from outside the empire. The conclusion (should be) exactly what you laid out. Freedom, and a lot of other things we value are really the result of societal progression.

IMO, it's essential to make this argument.

2 - To make analogies to the present.

"In the past, people thought it was OK to X. Today, we don't."

3 - It's a baid faith argument. China suppressing traditional minorities because "the americans did it." This context is just a character assassination attempt and it's bad.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#142
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're phrasing this as though censorship of leftism were a hypothetical, when in fact it's been happening for over a century. Read about the Red Scare (both the well-known one in the 1950s and the lesser-known one after World War I) [1] and COINTELPRO [2] for a start. There's even an example in the thread: the DHS confronted the person about "anti-American sentiment" for posting a video about police brutality. Conti…

You'd do better with examples that aren't from the 1950s. And #2 was run by Deep Throat (Mike Felt) himself.

Cointelpro ran into the 70's. Also you should read some Chomsky. Lots of examples of thought control.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#143

It would be helpful for people who have previously come out against cancel culture and deplatforming to defend the principle for someone who is not a member of their political tribe. Independent of the content of the video and who it happened to offend, the deceptive practice of shadow banning is reprehensible. Tar-pitting spammers is one thing, deceiving creators, especially ones who are politically engaged as to th…

It would be helpful for people who have previously come out against cancel culture and deplatforming to defend the principle for someone who is not a member of their political tribe Granted. Principle defended and censorship of other political tribes condemned. So does that mean we now get an apology from the other lot if the tables have indeed turned?

This is pretty snarky.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#144
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're phrasing this as though censorship of leftism were a hypothetical, when in fact it's been happening for over a century. Read about the Red Scare (both the well-known one in the 1950s and the lesser-known one after World War I) [1] and COINTELPRO [2] for a start. There's even an example in the thread: the DHS confronted the person about "anti-American sentiment" for posting a video about police brutality. Conti…

You'd do better with examples that aren't from the 1950s. And #2 was run by Deep Throat (Mike Felt) himself.

A mixed-race or same-sex couple on TV? A quarterback mentioning racism?

The first has only become commonly accepted in the last decade or so. The latter is even more recent.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#145
post #108

Just watched the video, read the thread. Here are some thoughts. First of all, the video uploader is promoting a competitor to YouTube. This is not disclaimed clearly. The video goes over criticism to the CIA, which are fair enough. But it takes some things as axioms, for example, that only the US are interfering/meddling in the world. He presents it as "the US is the bad guy and the world would be fair without the C…

I saw the video as well. > First of all, the video uploader is promoting a competitor to YouTube. This is not disclaimed clearly. You are starting of by literally the last thing on the video which is the promotion of the uploader's income stream, a standard practice for full-time youtubers... to prove what? > The video goes over criticism to the CIA, which are fair enough. But it takes some things as axioms, for exam…

>The sooner people realize that, the better. Beyond that, there is an argument here for having transparent practices. There is nothing preventing youtube from saying the truth about what they do.

Indeed.

About the criticism, it really sounds like that to me in the video. It implies in the way it is written, and I don't wanna go over details of the script, but pay attention to moments when he mentions "like a good democracy" and so on.

The current status of world dominance/power is an evolution of previous iterations (be it good or bad). But we never had a democratic system the CIA is breaking. The video is presented in a way that if you don't know all of that you will assume the CIA is making the world bad. It is just one more player amongst many, and just a continuation of something that is going on since the Romans.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voltaire said something like "to know who your masters are, look at who you can't criticize".

That quote is often attributed to Voltaire, but, sadly, it actually belongs to Kevin Alfred Strom, a white nationalist.[0] Doesn't make the quote less true though. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Alfred_Strom#%22True_Rul...

Yeah, the dying orphans with leukemia are holding all the reigns.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like yourself that constantly bring up the wrongs of the past and constantly remind people that things were less than perfect in the past constantly don't seem to understand that: * Much like many things society progresses, generally in the western world that progression has tended towards greater liberty (in most respects) of its citizens e.g. Tom Holland (a documentary film maker in the UK) argues the separa…

Bringing up "the wrongs of the past" is entirely appropriate in response to a comment asking about why America was founded.

No. It is largely irrelevant to what the person's point was because they weren't really asking why America was founded. I am sure you will quote it verbatim and say "it says exactly those words" while ignoring the actual intent.

Re: YouTube shadowbans video titled “The CIA is a Terrorist Organization”

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would add one additional qualifier to your statement, it was wealthy white men, not merely white men. To the extent we tend to project the past onto the present, it doesn't make sense to see a random white male construction worker as part of this powerful elite who was denying women the right to vote or enslaving anyone. It was a very small number of people who had power, and like all people in power, wrote rules t…

This is actually a really interesting point/question, and it's one that doesn't have an easy answer. It's true that, overall, most slaves (in pre-civil-war US) were owned by a small number of plantations. But in some southern states, nearly half the White families owned at least one slave. In those families, obviously the women and children didn't themselves "own" any slaves, but they nevertheless controlled that per…

You say this Civil War bit as if the proletariat has ever had significant say in whether they are commissioned into wars. Even if they individually supported war and slavery, they had no power to start a war over it. It was the wealthy elite.
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