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China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

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Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#61

>moderately prosperous society in all respects. >satisfaction rate among locals was over 99 percent >About 1.88 million people living in poor mountainous areas have been relocated to urban areas >Various supporting measures have been taken to ensure that at least one person on average in each relocated household gets employed. Reads like an Onion article.

The satisfaction rate is arguably a bad metric. Would anyone in rural China tell a government surveyor they were dissatisfied with their government-supplied job? I doubt it. There's a reason this book: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1442256885/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b... spends so much time talking about the problems with government-supplied housing, income, jobs, education, etc ... it makes it nearly impossible to not sid…

> Would anyone in rural China tell a government surveyor they were dissatisfied with their government-supplied job? I doubt it.

Of course they would if they can. Those are two different governments: the government-supplied job is supplied by the local government, while the surveyor is sent by the provincial or central government. Complaining to them about the local government is an opportunity to have the central government step in and rectify the issue.

Of course local governments know that as well, and to avoid having people tell on them, they use all kinds of tricks to deceive the surveyors. Depthpaper magazine published an investigative report last year https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/hXPd-mFNnnxQheR7tB64WQ on a particular case where the local government was ordered to stop trying to interfere (so their deception failed). One thing they did was to find out in advance which households would be visited, and then they handed out various goods bought in advance, to make it look like that family had been enjoying a relatively high standard of living for quite some time.

Since the central government's success rate at detecting cheating local governments is probably not that high, I expect that there are still a lot of counties that are officially above the poverty line but actually still below it.

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#62
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on why it is such a great achievement? Seems like a pretty natural consequence of their growing economy.

It's not a natural consequence of economic growth. The United States has hundreds of thousands of people living in extreme poverty, if not more, despite being one of the most developed countries in the world. Why didn't all the growth end it here?

These are semantic games. This isn’t talking about no one in poverty. This is the equivalent of the United States saying there are no states in a state of poverty. Would you care to characterize any states as being in a state of poverty? How is it defined for a state to be in poverty? Given this is a government created list that the government promised to finish by the end of 2020 and that no one but the government is capable of validating it, what are the odds this is at least somewhat a political tool rather than a legitimate accomplishment?

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#63
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Don't forget the Great Leap Forward( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward ). Sure, it was 60 years ago, but 18-45 million people starved in the service of the same authoritarian regime in power today. China continues to bully its regional neighbors like Vietnam over dubious claims to the regional seas. Now, to be fair, I'm typing this on land formerly inhabited by American Indians, in a nation with a hist…

You're able to discuss the issues, but you are very much not able to push for changes.

Nobody has successfully pushed back on any aspect of the war on terror my entire life, including 2 different Presidents who came in saying it should be rolled back. The newest one doesn't even give it lip service.

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know what else is a great achievement? The very cool concentration camps chilling in Xinjiang.

While those camps are not ideal, they don't detract from the achievement of lifting hundreds of millions out of poverty in a few decades.

This is like saying Jim Crow didn’t detract from America’s achievements in the 1950s, and 60s.

Anyone who suffers oppression, just will see these achievements as adding insult to injury.

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#65

CGTN is to China what RT is for Russia. Economics is a zero-sum-game; if they lifted everyone in China out of poverty, then poverty is exported to other countries or the nature paid all the costs. Edit: Nature is a silent sufferer in the economics. It acted as cushion to our misadventures, a-bomb(wars), oil-spills, co2 & other gases, industrial wastes, nuclear wastes. For a person to become rich, they have to earn pr…

What? There is technically more than enough to go around. Why does someone always have to be in poverty in your world view?

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know what else is a great achievement? The very cool concentration camps chilling in Xinjiang.

While those camps are not ideal, they don't detract from the achievement of lifting hundreds of millions out of poverty in a few decades.

They absolutely detract from that achievement.

Imagine making an account just to defend concentration camps.

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#67
post #28
post #4

And they also supposedly only have 93k confirmed COVID cases. Not sure I believe this.

While I share your skepticism, there doesn't seem to be much room for cover-up here (though I'm sure the initial outbreak was significantly under-counted). My understanding is that restrictions are pretty minimal apart from strict control of travelers. So either there is basically no community spread or it's likely to be rampant - and then the hospitals would be overflowing like they are in the US, which is much much…

Why do you graciously accept the numbers from the CCP while ignoring any evidence towards a cover-up? Do you actually believe the CCP has the pandemic under control? The amount of propaganda spread by the CCP trough their state controlled media is insane and wholly inaccurate. The CCP also conveniently put the blame squarely at foreign nationals bringing the virus over every single time. as if there are no cases of citizens transmissions at all. Transparency is expected in democratic countries. No such force exists in China.

https://www.ntd.com/ccp-covers-up-virus-surge-in-shanghai_52... https://www.ntd.com/chinese-city-goes-on-full-lockdown-after...

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#69
post #57
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

lifting a billion people out of poverty, would be a big achievment in terms of economic planning, logistics and resource planning. those are no small tasks. also while maintaining social integrity. yeah, the ccp takes away a lot of freedoms, but how would you do maintain a cohesive society ?

>maintaining social integrity >takes away a lot of freedoms pick one?

In order for social integrity to be maintained we need to give up some freedoms.

Re: China delists all remaining poverty-stricken counties

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so funny about it? I've been to rural China, and it tracks with the improvements I saw. But maybe that's anecdotal, do you have more insight on the matter?

My country had 99% election approval during communism as well. China propably made some progress, but numbers are just propaganda. If anything certain muslim regions are far from happy.

> If anything certain muslim regions are far from happy.

"Certain Muslim regions" really means only Xinjiang and the Uighurs living within (and some of the much smaller Kazakh and Kyrgyz population, too). The Muslim minority in central China has long since assimilated to the Han majority in their political opinions.

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