Live data from Hacker News

My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

medium.com

111–120 of 467 posts

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#111
post #87

Buried lede: > My daughter doesn’t return home from school until 6:30 pm and still has to eat, bathe, and get ready for bed. Perhaps it is not just the iPhone, but school taking up 100% of her time, energy, and attention that is preventing her from pursuing creative interests? As a homeschooling parent whose kids have been in school at times, I see this first hand. School is exhausting . Between rising unnaturally ea…

This exactly. That she's returning home from school at 6:30! The author didn't give their daughter's age, but we can assume it's right before 14, so maybe 12-13. I'm in high school, and I take a couple HL IB classes, school always gets out for me at 3, and then I do cross country until 5. That is already a long day. Then I go home, eat, do homework, and depending on the workload it could be anywhere between 8:00-12:00. Finally I'm able to go to bed, and redo the whole thing. I am a high schooler, and I'm taking high level classes for credits in college. The author's daughter is probably a middle schooler.

The issue is the daughter doesn't have time to be creative. I program, edit videos, etc., but all of that I have to save for the weekends. The daughter probably doesn't have the energy to be creative and just uses their phone during some downtime.

With my generation we are not always on our phones like many would believe. Pre-covid we would gather and talk after school, during lunch, in class. If I went with my friends to lunch it is acceptable to check your phone but we would never find it acceptable to be on your phone the whole time.

The issue is probably not the daughter, but the workload.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#112
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My parents struggling with e-mail is no way the same thing as lacking social skills. That just seems a lack of technology skills. My point was that saying Snapchat or social media leads to greater social skills than what previous generations had is very hard for me to believe.

Tomato tomato You can communicate via a method your parents can't because you used it extensively in your prime while they didn't. Your grandparents probably had the same issue with fax machines and your grandchildren will probably have the same problem with neural-messaging. Every generation thinks "but this time it's different" and every generation is wrong.

I will still say that lacking the ability to communicate via a particular medium is not the same as lacking social skills. My inability to send messages via Morse code over telegraph lines doesn't mean that I lack social skills.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#113
I find it hard to think this is not causation.

I had a habit opening LinkedIn every now and then to glance at the content. Sometimes I would quickly close, sometimes I read a bit and close, sometimes longer.. anyway that's a distraction from whatever I am doing.

I did a small experiment recently on LinkedIn. I unfollowed everyone. My LinkedIn feed is empty. I don't open LinkedIn as much now, think about it.. it faded away.

I really like having no feed.

Then I wondered what Facebook would be like without a Feed.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#114
post #96
post #87

Buried lede: > My daughter doesn’t return home from school until 6:30 pm and still has to eat, bathe, and get ready for bed. Perhaps it is not just the iPhone, but school taking up 100% of her time, energy, and attention that is preventing her from pursuing creative interests? As a homeschooling parent whose kids have been in school at times, I see this first hand. School is exhausting . Between rising unnaturally ea…

I have done home schooling and regular public schooling. If you can afford to have a parent be at home full time with your kids, you are amongst the wealthiest in the world. You are fortunate.

It's ridiculous that you were downvoted because this is exactly right. Assuming one works federal minimum wage for 40hrs/week and 52 weeks a year with no days off and no taxes, they make roughly $15k by my math. How could a three-person family, with two parents making $30k total, possibly afford to homeschool the child?

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#115
It is my store too as a parent of a single child losing creativity to instant pleasures and doom scrolling on an iPhone.

To add salt to injury, the dance team at school she is part of encourages them to post on Facebook and Instagram. They have study groups on Facebook, Discord, Slack and even Instagram.

When I demand they use simple old style text messaging, she has friends with fancy phones but no SIM card and depend on Instagram messaging for everything.

I have given up after going through frustrating, helpless and endless hours of convincing.

Lack of ability to focus will be the serious limiting factor for innovation and creativity. I see it at work where you get engineers cannot persevere to solve hard problems. Agile has become them excuse to do some quick hack and throw it across the wall.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#116
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having never been an 11 year old girl in a pandemic, I can't really speak to what "normal" is. Based on the the girl's behavior as described in the article, it certainly has had no noticeable negative effects.

It's not about the pandemic, it's not even about phones but about the technology/software running on them that turn them into skinner boxes.

It's not about the concerts, it's not even about the guitars, it's about the music played on them that turns kids into satanists.

If covid happened in 1990, we'd all be on our land lines for 9 hours a day, and there would be nothing wrong with that either.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#117
post #96
post #87

Buried lede: > My daughter doesn’t return home from school until 6:30 pm and still has to eat, bathe, and get ready for bed. Perhaps it is not just the iPhone, but school taking up 100% of her time, energy, and attention that is preventing her from pursuing creative interests? As a homeschooling parent whose kids have been in school at times, I see this first hand. School is exhausting . Between rising unnaturally ea…

I have done home schooling and regular public schooling. If you can afford to have a parent be at home full time with your kids, you are amongst the wealthiest in the world. You are fortunate.

Your assertion that only families among "the wealthiest in the world" have non-school childcare arrangements is incorrect.

I agree that everyone should have access to better child-rearing opportunities than are offered by school, especially public school in North America. I'd love to see homework eliminated, more time in school devoted to play, more tracking & opportunities for everyone to develop their strengths (be they calculus or auto mechanics), and the elimination of compulsory secondary schooling (let the kids come who want to come & make it rewarding enough that they do, rather than threatening to jail their parents to bring them to heel).

I am ignoring the aspects of your comment directed towards me personally.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is 1 and 2 true at the same time? It seems more like he set boundaries, then let his daughter run past them. Setting boundaries is hard, it takes strength, but you can't sacrifice boundaries to "keep the peace". Short team peace is long term hell.

They are bad parents for not sticking to boundaries on occasions. They are good parents for caring enough to try to have boundaries,, thinking about the positive and negative impact the phone and apps may have on her. Sure, nothing can be true and false _in the same respect and same time_ (Law of Non-Contradiction), but I routinely feel I'm both a good and bad parent.

I agree on all points. I assumed you meant it that way, but wasn't sure.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#119

I believe this is a huge problem in our society. And I recommmend everyone who downplays it to watch "The social dilemma". There are a few aspects which are worrying: - Social pressure to be connected constantly increases for children below 14 years. - Sites like TikTok, Reddit, Twitter, etc. are designed to be addictive. Children at such a young age do not have the same level of self control like you. - The longer k…

> Social pressure to be connected constantly increases for children below 14 years.

This is absolutely a problem, but I don't think it's a problem that can be solved at an individual level, and denying this privilege to your child would IMO do more harm than good as they'd miss out on social events or provide a reason for bullying, etc.

Withdrawing from social media and the bullshit rat race of the "attention economy" is absolutely the right thing to do, but it has to be a voluntary decision.

I don't have a link to it but I remember reading an article which was saying something alone the lines of everyone having a limited amount of "weirdness points" and that we must spend them wisely. In today's society, being isolated from social media is a "weirdness point" (whether we like it or not) and it's up to each individual to determine whether it is worth for them to take the hit.

I have withdrawn from social media as an adult because I am at a stage in life where I don't have to prove anything to anyone, don't have to be "cool" kid and have other ways to play the "status game". However for a typical teenager social media popularity and the "cool" factor is probably their biggest assets when it comes to status and I don't think it's fair to be putting them at a disadvantage by denying them access to it.

Re: My daughter was a creative genius, and then we bought her an iPhone

#120

We have a natural tendency to worry about kids, if the technology really is different this time, and dangerous to be giving kids. Here's another perspective: are there socially well-adjusted adults who get sucked into it and ruin their lives? We're inclined to care about the kids most, but kids are resilient and continue to grow and adjust and change over the years. What about their parents? Are there adults who get…

Lost years as an adult might be more easily replaced.

For a kid who blows off high school, where is the recovery? Many paths in life are more-or-less closed off.

Post reply on HN