Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions • Hacker News Board

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#71

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:04 AM UTC

conjectures wrote: post #65

LatteLazy wrote: post #30

This perfectly epitomises the uk (and the rest of the worlds) attitude to global warming: * it's a non binding commitment to do something but not for at least a decade * it's not enough even if it does happen * it will be too late by then (it probably already is for anything but drastic action) * it's totally at the whim of future governments who will be no more willing to spend the money/time/popularity than the cur…

On this specific issue, what more could be done, really? Bring the ban to 2025? 2022? One can't simply expect mass production to switch that fast. UK has already tightened emissions rules on vehicles and VED taxes more polluting cars more heavily. They could, and probably will, ratchet things more. The right response on this policy is to say: great thanks Boris, you can clearly see the potential in green tech, now co…

[deleted]

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#72

Post by calcifer » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:04 AM UTC

Jetrel wrote: post #60

physicsguy wrote: post #31

Many, many houses do not have anything other than on-street parking here. Since 2012 I've lived in 5 houses, and three of them had no driveway. I'm currently buying a house which has no drive way, with no way of fitting one. Apparently 1/3 houses have only on street parking. Unless they also provide huge, huge grants to rapidly implement dense onstreet charging, and fast, this is a pipedream and will end up getting p…

I mean, with new teslas, their range is similar enough to gas cars that you only need to charge them about once a week, if that. And they charge fast enough that it's not terribly dissimilar from hitting the gas station, which currently is perhaps a 10 minute affair for gas. Bumping that to ~20min isn't a dealbreaker. It's feasible, if a little bit annoying, to have a refueling story for them that's similar to that o…

> which currently is perhaps a 10 minute affair for gas. Bumping that to ~20min isn't a dealbreaker

Here in the UK 10 minutes is already on the upper end of acceptable, I can't remember the last time it took me that long. 20 minutes would definitely be a dealbreaker for the vast majority of people.

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#73

Post by Ma8ee » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:05 AM UTC

anovikov wrote: post #38

LatteLazy wrote: post #30

This perfectly epitomises the uk (and the rest of the worlds) attitude to global warming: * it's a non binding commitment to do something but not for at least a decade * it's not enough even if it does happen * it will be too late by then (it probably already is for anything but drastic action) * it's totally at the whim of future governments who will be no more willing to spend the money/time/popularity than the cur…

But on the other hand, this IS indeed a super drastic action and we can't expect any nation on Earth apart from possibly, a few city-states like Singapore, to do as much in the same time frame. Petrol cars will be mainstay of transportation for about 40-50 years and will dominate new car sales for at least 20-30 years depending on the country. Anything but classic petrol and diesel cars will still hold tiny market sh…

You are way off. It took about 15 years to go from cities dominated by horse carriages to them being dominated by cars. It took longer in agriculture and rural areas. But the shift to electrical vehicles is trivial in comparison. Technically and economically we could easily prohibit new fossil fuelled cars by 2025.

Sun and wind power is already much cheaper to install than coal powered plants, and once sun and wind power is up the energy is almost free. Fossil fuel companies are currently struggling, just from this simple economy.

[0] https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-motor-vehicle...

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#74

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:05 AM UTC

djmobley wrote: post #43

LatteLazy wrote: post #30

This perfectly epitomises the uk (and the rest of the worlds) attitude to global warming: * it's a non binding commitment to do something but not for at least a decade * it's not enough even if it does happen * it will be too late by then (it probably already is for anything but drastic action) * it's totally at the whim of future governments who will be no more willing to spend the money/time/popularity than the cur…

I think you’ve completely missed the point of what is a very reasonable and forward-thinking signalling exercise. You cannot have sudden cliff-edges in policies (like banning the sale of new ICE vehicles) that would put thousands, if not millions of people out of jobs. You need to send signals like this to the market well in advance so they can invest and plan ahead.

[deleted]

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#75

Post by arethuza » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:05 AM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #34

rightbyte wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are not Scotland, Wales and England each countries though?

> Are not Scotland, Wales and England each countries though? Sure, but in a sense where UK “countries” are a thing somewhat like US “states” (but somewhat less, in that neither is independent, but US states are notionally sovereign nevertheless.) The UK is the entity which is a sovereign and independent entity.

There are amusing anomalies such as the UK constituent countries having their own international sporting teams in some sports.

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#76

Post by throwaway69123 » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:05 AM UTC

barnacled wrote: post #68

This is utterly ridiculous. I live in the UK and have been renting for many years, I've lived at 15+ addresses and not at a single one could I have powered the car from home. Not one. The UK is small, cars are squeezed onto tiny roads and most people do on-street parking, i.e. you park where you can. When I last had a car I could only park around the corner from my flat (which was set far back from the road). Having…

Doesn’t the power come from the street? Seems like adding metered street parking wouldn’t be a big deal and a great source of revenue for gov to replace fuel tax that is lost

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#77

Post by zimpenfish » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:06 AM UTC

barnacled wrote: post #68

This is utterly ridiculous. I live in the UK and have been renting for many years, I've lived at 15+ addresses and not at a single one could I have powered the car from home. Not one. The UK is small, cars are squeezed onto tiny roads and most people do on-street parking, i.e. you park where you can. When I last had a car I could only park around the corner from my flat (which was set far back from the road). Having…

> i.e. you park where you can > off-street parking is a luxury here that only a small % of people have

That would indicate there's just too many cars and we should be prioritising public transport improvements.

> outside of London public transport is extremely expensive, very very unreliable

100% agree - it's always a shock when I go up north and have to use public transport - but that's why we need to divert money from the road and car subsidy schemes into massive public transport improvements.

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#78

Post by newlytread » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:06 AM UTC

brtkdotse wrote: post #58

djmobley wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you’ve completely missed the point of what is a very reasonable and forward-thinking signalling exercise. You cannot have sudden cliff-edges in policies (like banning the sale of new ICE vehicles) that would put thousands, if not millions of people out of jobs. You need to send signals like this to the market well in advance so they can invest and plan ahead.

> You cannot have sudden cliff-edges in policies Brexit has entered the chat

I wouldn’t call anything about Brexit sudden or well designed

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#79

Post by arethuza » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:07 AM UTC

Jaruzel wrote: post #10

valleyer wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty common to use "Britain" (usually not "Great Britain", though) as shorthand for "the UK state". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britain_(place_name)#Modern_us... > The term Britain is widely used as a common name for the sovereign state of the United Kingdom, or UK for short.

As a Brit[1] this convention still irks me. Maybe we should just be American about it, and call the whole of the UK 'England', and pretend Scotland is it's own country? /s --- [1] Yes, I get the irony of calling myself a 'Brit', but 'Uker' just doesn't sound right.

I suspect most people from the UK when asked their nationality will answer English, Scottish etc.

Re: Britain to ban new petrol cars and vans by 2030 on road to net zero emissions

#80

Post by Normal_gaussian » Wed, Nov 18, 2020, 9:08 AM UTC

brtkdotse wrote: post #58

djmobley wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you’ve completely missed the point of what is a very reasonable and forward-thinking signalling exercise. You cannot have sudden cliff-edges in policies (like banning the sale of new ICE vehicles) that would put thousands, if not millions of people out of jobs. You need to send signals like this to the market well in advance so they can invest and plan ahead.

> You cannot have sudden cliff-edges in policies Brexit has entered the chat

This is a perfect example. Talked about by the forces that enacted it as early as 2010, the Brexit referendum happens in 2016, and leaving the EU has been gradually happening since then.