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So you've made a mistake and it's public

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Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#91

Post by khazhoux »

pugworthy wrote: post #81
khazhoux wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Strong disagree. The vast majority of subreddits are fine. Toxicity is compartmentalized to specific subreddits, which you can very easily avoid. On the other hand, I find a community like Stack Overflow to be much worse because the BS can strike any time, any place. Between questions marked "Off-Topic", and snarky replies, and the non-replies ("We won't answer your simple question because you should not be asking th…

I also agree. I find both Twitter and Reddit to be on the most part delightful sources of information. I do have a certain self-made bubble in terms of who I follow, but it's a bubble full of creators, artists, and those that want to share what they've done in a positive way.

Exactly! Reddit's anonymity and the sheer scale of the site make bullying impossible (hard to imagine /u/subhumanbuttocks88 being victimized by /u/mandocalrissian).

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#93

Post by NalNezumi »

macspoofing wrote: post #23

I'm not sure apologizing publicly has made anything better for any individual, especially in the current moral panic climate. Mobs don't accept apologies. Public apologies stamp official guilt on the individual and therefore serve as a license for the mob to further punish them because now they have admitted their fault and therefore are 'officially' guilty of the crime. Public apologies, therefore, are the metaphori…

The best course of action in public apology that includes potential mobs running rampant is to wait.

If possible, do not immediately make any statement and if in a organization, make an "we are investigating" response. Most mobs are moved by emotions and herd mentality so just being silent for a while can disperse the worst of the mobs.

Make an thorough apology (like the guideline here) later.

Most internet mobs just move on to the next totem pole to burn in days so this seems to work (and is indeed how a lot of companies respond if they can't just fire someone and get over it)

A real mob, such as campus students can be a bit more troublesome.

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#94

Post by screye »

In the age of social media I would suggest a different approach to addressing public mistakes.

1. Go silent.

> Complete public blackout. No denying, no accepting. The people want retribution, not justice. The media blackout is essential.

2. Reflect on it privately and quietly.

3. If not in violation of #1, apologize to the individual people/entity affected in private.

4. Once the mob dissipates, address the issue publically in long form.

> It is very important that it be a boring, long and solemn take on the mistake. Blog, interview, podcast, whatever.

5. Don't blame. period.

6. Set a roadmap to rehabilitation/mitigation.

7. Actually follow #6

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#95

Post by aequitas »

lapetitejort wrote: post #21
justin_oaks wrote: post #2

> What should I do when I see someone else is making a mistake? > When you see others making mistakes, first help them see their mistakes and deal with them (e.g. by recycling this text, or by independently offering your analysis and answers to Steps 1 and 2 above). > Remember you make mistakes too, and be tolerant of the time it may take people to accept that they have made a mistake. (But you don't need to allow th…

It should be noted that you should contact them about their mistake in the most private way possible, then escalating slowly as the need arises. This follows the "praise in public, punish in private" maxim.

This makes me think, it is opposite to what mostly is used in open source projects that have bugtrackers. Github is filled with countless 'mistakes' (issues/pr's) people made in the code they published. Should there be some kind of way to make issues private?

Before I was into open source I was always afraid to show my code to anyone because of the critique I could expect. But some coworkers helped me get the confidence I needed to go open source (within the company, not public internet). Being completely open about everything and accepting critique publicly really helped me grow as a developer to also be open to others. I wonder if I would have made the same transformation if I was only critiqued in private.

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#96

Post by mcguire »

macspoofing wrote: post #23

I'm not sure apologizing publicly has made anything better for any individual, especially in the current moral panic climate. Mobs don't accept apologies. Public apologies stamp official guilt on the individual and therefore serve as a license for the mob to further punish them because now they have admitted their fault and therefore are 'officially' guilty of the crime. Public apologies, therefore, are the metaphori…

Let's pretend for a minute that you have a conscience and feel bad about the effects of the mistake---not just the effects of having the mistake discovered. What if you have harmed someone you cared about? Would you still apply the strategy you are advocating?

Perhaps apologies do "serve as a license for the mob to further punish". Even so, what is the result to your life or to an organization of doing what you suggest?

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#97

Post by js2 »

Zelphyr wrote: post #62

Something that I would include with the apology part (the text may have covered this and I missed it) is that apologies don't have but's. "I'm sorry I funded Wikimedia Antarctica but..." Everything you say after the but negates everything you say before it and now you're only trying to justify your actions. Simply, "I'm sorry I funded Wikimedia Antarctica." and proceed to describe what you learned: "I neglected to lo…

People confuse explanations with excuses. It's okay to provide an explanation as long as you're not excusing the thing you did was wrong. For example:

"I apologize for shouting at you. I was short on sleep and frustrated about something else. I was wrong to take out my frustration on you."

vs:

"I apologize for shouting at you but I was tired and frustrated."

An explanation can make the apology stronger because it demonstrates that you realize what it is you're apologizing for.

Re: So you've made a mistake and it's public

#99

Post by simonebrunozzi »

screye wrote: post #94

In the age of social media I would suggest a different approach to addressing public mistakes. 1. Go silent. > Complete public blackout. No denying, no accepting. The people want retribution, not justice. The media blackout is essential. 2. Reflect on it privately and quietly. 3. If not in violation of #1, apologize to the individual people/entity affected in private. 4. Once the mob dissipates, address the issue pub…

This is a really great list.
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