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Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

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Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#111

Post by jm20 »

Loughla wrote: post #84
whimsicalism wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're literally moving millions of dollars a year through your billing platform. That's not a little bit of money. That's a lot. Own it. Nobody said it was a little bit of money? Where is this comment coming from?

I think OP's point was, if you're moving that much money, you shouldn't be relying on a third party vendor; doing so shifts the blame from them, to you, for not controlling your own payments. That's what I read in that post. I have no idea if it's a good point or not.

There’s a big difference between “millions of dollars” and “relying on a third party vendor for payments.” I don’t know of many sub-$1B companies that implement their own payments infrastructure...

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#113

Post by TAForObvReasons »

dawnerd wrote: post #108
TAForObvReasons wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've been chipping away at the grandfathered accounts this year. What bothered me the most was earlier this year when they stopped refunding fees when issuing refunds. They rolled out a feature during the early days of the pandemic, and in the same week they started charging older accounts for refunds https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22371330

Is there anyone left that refunds fees? Paypal stopped last year and AFAIK all of the other processors also keep the fee.

Amazon payments apparently does: https://pay.amazon.com/help/201212280

> If a refund takes place, you will also be refunded the following transaction fees:

> - The domestic processing fee (for example, the 2.9% fee)

> - The cross-border processing fee (for example, the 3.9% fee)

> Note that the Authorization fee and Disputed chargeback fee are non-refundable.

So it looks like Amazon Payments holds onto the 30 cents but refunds the variable part. It's obviously not zero, but for a $100 domestic charge Amazon's 30 cents is much less than the $29.30 that Stripe pockets.

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#114

Post by radihuq »

jdreaver wrote: post #109
radihuq wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks pc! OT: You're very active, and usually one of the first to get involved, in Stripe-related discussions on HN. I'm curious how you manage this. Do you lurk HN all day like me and spot the new Stripe-related threads, or do others at Stripe let you know when they see a Stripe-related thread?

I've always wondered if there is a business opportunity here: a company that monitors social media for all mentions of your business and pings you about it. Maybe this already exists?

I do think there are existing applications that provide this service (ex: Hootsuite[0]). I think a layman could probably setup Google Alerts[1] to achieve the desired results for topics they're interested in (like your company)

I'm curious how Patrick does it though as his attention isn't exactly cheap

[0](https://hootsuite.com/platform/monitor)

[1](https://www.google.ca/alerts)

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#115

Post by amadeuspagel »

edwinwee wrote: post #29

Edwin from Stripe here. It’s worth distinguishing between charging money on Stripe (for which you incur payments pricing) and using Stripe Billing (which is a separately-paid product). Stripe Billing has had this pricing for a few years. For some longtime users of Subscriptions, we originally didn’t change their pricing but are doing so now. We think charging a separate fee for our Billing product is fair, given comp…

AWS doesn't charge anything for elastic beanstalk beyond the standard price for resources, even though of course competing products like heroku charge a lot more. I'm not arguing about fairness, I'm sure that's not a concern for AWS either, but if you have a basic product with solid margins, doesn't it make sense to account something you build on top of that product as marketing or documentation, rather then as a distinct product that has to pay for itself?

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#116

Post by dang »

I've changed the title from "Stripe is now charging 0.5% more for recurring charges", which apparently is misleading, to one that is, though clunky, apparently accurate.

If anyone can suggest a better title—that is, accurate and neutral, and preferably with less clunk—we can change it again.

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#117

Post by jm20 »

loceng wrote: post #50
TAForObvReasons wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Earlier this year, they made other changes for long-term customers: - increased fees for non-US payments (3.9% + 30 cents) - did not refund fees when you refund customers If there was a compelling alternative that isn't PayPal we'd jump in a heartbeat

I have to believe this is Stripe leadership pumping up the revenues/profits to look peachy for their IPO, so they can all get a considerable exit while raising a war chest - meanwhile competitors will come along and try to take market share while Stripe can spend more on acquisitions and feature development for the same price. I think this play as part of the VC industrial complex leaves them more vulnerable than is…

If the Stripe leadership wanted to exit and be set for generations they could’ve done it years ago. I agree it could be a revenue boost to prepare for IPO but this isn’t some personal greed thing

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#118

Post by harrisonjackson »

For those of you that have negotiated better rates with Stripe or other vendors - are they committed to those rates for some amount of time or total volume?

Stripe billing competes with Recurly and Chargebee. Anyone using those products that has had similar price increases? How were they handled?

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#119

Post by PaybackTony »

dmlittle wrote: post #98
PaybackTony wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of the interchange rate is charged directly by Visa / Mastercard. The merchant bank will then add basis points to that, and often you get another mark-up by the individual ISO (independent sales organization) in a typical set up. So, then, why do card processors charge percentage? Well, when you see those Capital One commercials where you get 1% cashback on this type of purchase or 2% cashback on this, that's wh…

Isn't that rate part of the 2.9% + 30c fee? Not the additional 0.5% for Stripe Billing.

Absolutely. I took the question as to why a percentage is charged for card transactions at all. The additional 0.5% is most definitely a "because they can" type of pricing and that's more an economics theory discussion. The market has shown a willingness to put up with that pricing and therefore a value proposition is set so until something changes no reason to price differently if the market is willing to pay a model with a much higher margin. I don't necessarily agree but that's a sound short-term business decision. I know from experience that sometimes going into a market with an established pricing model, however unfair, with a better pricing model for the customer can be bad for business and result not only in less profit per sale, but fewer customers making the buy decision because of the pricing model expectations that have already been set by the market. It baffles me, but I'm no economics major.

Re: Stripe migrates Stripe Subscriptions users to more expensive Stripe Billing

#120

Post by pc »

radihuq wrote: post #103
pc wrote: post #93

(Stripe cofounder.) Hi folks -- as Edwin points out elsewhere in the thread, the article title isn't accurate. (I'll update or delete my comment if it's fixed.) [Update: it was changed. It used to read "Stripe is now charging 0.5% more for recurring charges."] You can happily make recurring charges yourself and no additional fees are incurred. Lots of Stripe customers do this and we don't charge anything extra for it…

Thanks pc! OT: You're very active, and usually one of the first to get involved, in Stripe-related discussions on HN. I'm curious how you manage this. Do you lurk HN all day like me and spot the new Stripe-related threads, or do others at Stripe let you know when they see a Stripe-related thread?

Thanks! Mostly a slightly excessive affinity for HN. But sometimes people point me to stories too.
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