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Google users locked out after 15 years' use

businessinsider.com

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Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#481

Post by carapace »

A few comments in this thread rub me the wrong way. E.g.:

> It should be illegal.

> How is this not regulated?

No one forces you to use these services. They're voluntary.

Imagine you're looking for storage for some stuff.

One company advertises a storage service, which is free, but there's a clause in the contract that says, "We can take your stuff at any time, for any reason, no backsies."

Would you trust your stuff to that storage company?

No, you wouldn't. That's insane.

But somehow you rub a computer on it and everybody loses their common sense.

- - - -

Folks are naive (in re: computers) so you can either: 1) educate them, or 2) exploit them. FAANG et. al. choose to exploit their users, quite ruthlessly too IMO. A few companies actually try to educate their users (a very few. Adafruit, Wolfram, ... who else? I'm sure there are more but I'm drawing a blank right now. Basically any company that's built around teaching people what computers are and how to use computers, rather than farming "lusers".)

- - - -

To me the weird thing is how many people choose to be exploited peasants rather than educated Users.

It's extra-weird to me when the peasants start jumping up and down shouting "Rabble rabble!" instead of just using some other non-exploitative system.

(But then most folks' behaviour has never made sense to me, come to think of it. So what do I know? "Nationalize FAANG!" "Rabble rabble!")

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#482

Post by hedora »

LorenPechtel wrote: post #447
dheera wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once created a location-based file sharing web app [0] to simplify sharing non-sensitive content with people nearby, e.g. sharing slides for a public presentation with a room full of people. Anyone nearby just had to go to http://quack.space -- no funny long URLs. I never monetized it, but it got quite a few users and I definitely could have started a path to monetization. I had ideas, such as incorporating locatio…

I suspect it was basically legit--somebody used it to try to spread malware, their spider found it.

How is blocking an application because of the actions of one user “legit”?

If their spider were treating sites fairly, it’d also block google search, and the chrome team wouldn’t budge on the decision even though the rest of the company collapsed.

I hope the anti trust investigators focus on these sorts of instead of some trivially-bypassed thing, like bundling.

After the botched MS antitrust suit, I’m not holding my breath.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#483

Post by bdcravens »

tarruda wrote: post #453

I've saw quite a few similar stories over the past years and this left me very scared. I've been a heavy user of google services for more than 15 years. For some months now (maybe a year?) I've been trying to reduce dependency on google services and apps. It is a slow process, but I hope to get it done in the next year or so. Meanwhile I try to use google takeout as much as possible to keep up to date backups of my d…

Hey will be providing custom domain support soonish:

https://hey.com/custom-domains/

Microsoft 365 Business Basic has support for custom domains starting at $5/month.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#484

Post by dheera »

LorenPechtel wrote: post #447
dheera wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once created a location-based file sharing web app [0] to simplify sharing non-sensitive content with people nearby, e.g. sharing slides for a public presentation with a room full of people. Anyone nearby just had to go to http://quack.space -- no funny long URLs. I never monetized it, but it got quite a few users and I definitely could have started a path to monetization. I had ideas, such as incorporating locatio…

I suspect it was basically legit--somebody used it to try to spread malware, their spider found it.

Interesting. I blocked executable file types I knew of though. It's possible someone uploaded a MS Office file with a virus, a HTML file with a phishing scam or some such, though.

Still, I don't think it's right for Google to use their iron feet to stomp an entire website / product / small business / personal project just because of a small fraction of users abusing that service.

ALL services get abused at some point or another during their growth. Learning to deal with those abuses one at a time is a part of the growth of any product and nobody can be expected to have prevented all forms of abuse upfront. If the owners (e.g. me) were made aware of the specific piece of malware I would have definitely done something about it.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#485

Post by kyledrake »

Just to add to the giant pile of anecdotal stories here, Google has been on Gmail labeling all links to the 350,000 Neocities sites as "potentially malware" for a while now, despite the fact that we don't allow uploads of executable files so that's basically impossible. We've only had one valid malware report in our 7 years of operation (zip embedded in a gif file, which I now know how to detect so it's fixed).

There's nobody at Google to contact, so I have no idea how to fix it. I used to have a friend at google I could ask for special help from (this made me feel awful), but they no longer work there, so I guess I'm just screwed until they actually get some sort of official support channel, or somebody at the company that sees this message (hi!) fixes it somehow (thanks!).

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#486

Post by hedora »

bigwavedave wrote: post #342
fullstop wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got gmail accounts for my kids after they were born. My youngest, 12, attempted to sign in from a Windows PC in our house and was told that they could not verify that it was her. Keep in mind, this is the same public IP address that we've had for ages. I am the recovery contact for the account since she is a minor, and have filled out the forms several times now, even giving the exact date and the "verification cod…

I love protonmail! I made the switch a couple years back and haven't looked back, with one exception- my city's utilities company blacklists protonmail, so in the handful of times I've emailed them (specifically there were three times they've shut off my water because someone with a very similar looking address didn't pay their bill) with proof of something-or-other, it supposedly doesn't make it to their communal or…

If they’re incorrectly shutting off your water, read up on your legal rights, and then send a polite letter to their legal department and the local utility regulatory board.

Public utilities are highly regulated, and do not have the right to interrupt your service.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#487

Post by everdrive »

tomxor wrote: post #281

> The music he purchased through Google Music has also disappeared. "The app took it upon itself to delete all the downloaded music I had on my phone." If they are selling access to stuff via the account, surely revoking access without reason will have legal consequences. Couldn't it be viewed as consumer discrimination?

Always download MP3s (or whatever format you like) and never trust a cloud account.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#488

Post by bryan_w »

beowulfey wrote: post #429
slightwinder wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We do not pay for a home address What? You don't pay paxes in your country? No rent to the owner of your house or paid for owning the house yourself? What country is that?

I mean we do not pay the USPS or FedEx or UPS, etc. to agree to send mail to our address. I was making a comparison between mail and email services. Hopefully this clarifies what I meant.

This makes the case for USPS to provide email services.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#489

Post by weehoo »

hedora wrote: post #482
LorenPechtel wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect it was basically legit--somebody used it to try to spread malware, their spider found it.

How is blocking an application because of the actions of one user “legit”? If their spider were treating sites fairly, it’d also block google search, and the chrome team wouldn’t budge on the decision even though the rest of the company collapsed. I hope the anti trust investigators focus on these sorts of instead of some trivially-bypassed thing, like bundling. After the botched MS antitrust suit, I’m not holding my…

Write your representatives ! Some of them actually want to help, they just legitimately don’t realize the reality of the situation on the ground.

Re: Google users locked out after 15 years' use

#490

Post by specialist »

dunnevens wrote: post #399
cm2187 wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are a “customer”. How many people pay for google services? I know it’s kind of jerky but I still agree that if you aren’t paying for the service, you have no leg to complain about it.

Google isn't doing this out of the goodness of their heart. They're expecting to make money off of every signup in some way. Directly or indirectly. If they want to continue their dominant status, then they should be responsive in some way to their users. Sure, they have the right to cut off users any time they like. But it's ultimately self-destructive. Once trust is lost, it's difficult to regain it. I've moved awa…

Why do you assume Google is rational?

Or more precisely: Why do you think any outsider could understand Google's rational?

History is littered with the corpses of successful companies that lost their way.

Today's Google reminds me of General Motors. Utterly dominant, untouchable. But needed to keep making more money. So they bring auto loan financing in house, GMAC. Woot, more money. But they forgot how to make money making cars. So upstarts ate their lunch.

It's a rough analog. Maybe IBM is closer.

The point is Google's rolling in cash despite their antipathy towards their end users (note that I did not say "customers"). Which will continue to be fine, until it isn't. And then it'll be too late.

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