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Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

nytimes.com

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Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#51

Post by Accacin »

DanBC wrote: post #20
seattle_spring wrote: post #17

It's shocking, especially on a scientific forum like HN, that people get so triggered over being asked to wear a teensy extra bit of clothing that might protect those around them from dying.

Show me the science. We have lots of RCTs on mask wearing (mostly in healthcare professionals) and they struggle to find a benefit. People should wear masks, masks may help, but it's unhelpful when people misrepresent the strength of the evidence.

There's a few links in this thread, maybe you should read them.

> but it's unhelpful when people misrepresent the strength of the evidence

What exactly are your credentials, and why should I trust you?

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#52

Post by Accacin »

Quanttek wrote: post #29

This thread is quite embarrassing. The science is clear ( https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8,)yet HN still argues against it. But, unlike others, I don't think this very surprising. Many (not all) HN readers, being software engineers, have a high level of pretentiousness that comes from being good in one field, and then carry over that arrogance into areas where they have no clue. Suddenly, you see so…

You're being down-voted but I'm not sure what rules you've broken, so people should not be down-voting you.

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#53

Post by kovek »

crisdux wrote: post #48
40four wrote: post #38

This article has fancy animations and whatnot, but lacking in real data. So for anyone not convinced, here is a statistical analysis from my home state South Carolina. The numbers speak for themselves. https://scdhec.gov/news-releases/dhecs-third-data-analysis-m... https://scdhec.gov/news-releases/update-mask-requirement-dat... Highlights: When comparing the jurisdictions that have mask requirements in place to those…

For anyone convinced in this mask pseudoscience, here is extensive scientific literature over decades that establishes that wearing surgical masks, respirators and cotton masks do not reduce the risk of contracting verified illnesses. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19216002 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-inf... https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/j.1750-2659... https://www.…

Does the literature talk about reducing the risk of sharing those verified illnesses with others? For example, if a person has an illness that transmits through coughs, then if they wear a mask and cough, is the chance that people around them get the illness lower?

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#54

Post by thanatosmin »

crisdux wrote: post #48
40four wrote: post #38

This article has fancy animations and whatnot, but lacking in real data. So for anyone not convinced, here is a statistical analysis from my home state South Carolina. The numbers speak for themselves. https://scdhec.gov/news-releases/dhecs-third-data-analysis-m... https://scdhec.gov/news-releases/update-mask-requirement-dat... Highlights: When comparing the jurisdictions that have mask requirements in place to those…

For anyone convinced in this mask pseudoscience, here is extensive scientific literature over decades that establishes that wearing surgical masks, respirators and cotton masks do not reduce the risk of contracting verified illnesses. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19216002 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-inf... https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/j.1750-2659... https://www.…

I looked at three links here:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19216002

Is laughably underpowered. 2 people got a cold in one group, 1 in the other. There's nothing to derive from this.

bin-Reza is a review that does not agree with your statement.

Radonovich et al compares N95 and surgical masks, and finds no difference between those.

One has to actually read and critically evaluate scientific papers to learn something.

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#55

Post by jk700 »

DanBC wrote: post #20
seattle_spring wrote: post #17

It's shocking, especially on a scientific forum like HN, that people get so triggered over being asked to wear a teensy extra bit of clothing that might protect those around them from dying.

Show me the science. We have lots of RCTs on mask wearing (mostly in healthcare professionals) and they struggle to find a benefit. People should wear masks, masks may help, but it's unhelpful when people misrepresent the strength of the evidence.

> We have lots of RCTs on mask wearing (mostly in healthcare professionals) and they struggle to find a benefit.

This is false. If you look around and read actual studies, not demand other people to do it for you and not cherry pick garbage studies, you'll find even real life "experiments" of healthcare workers in the US during COVID-19 not wearing masks with rapidly rising number of COVID-19 cases then mandated to wear masks with subsequent rapid drop of cases.

What you won't find though is studies supporting the assertion that sick person wearing a mask protects others, not the wearer. Those are the studies that show little to no benefit and always did actually. You protect others with a mask by not catching the virus yourself, it's a second order effect.

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#56

Post by fooblat »

DanBC wrote: post #18

The headline says "masks work", then the article redefines masks to exclude the things that many people are wearing, and then adds further criteria that rules out most other people. It then fails to take into account research that shows that cotton masks become saturated with exhaled moisture and perspiration, and that stops their filtering properties. It also fails to take into account reductions in social distancin…

The dutch studied this and found that in the real world mask requirements caused no change in social distancing compliance[1].

1. https://nscr.nl/naleving-drukte-en-social-distancing-tijdens...

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#57

Post by dx87 »

Accacin wrote: post #46
DanBC wrote: post #18

The headline says "masks work", then the article redefines masks to exclude the things that many people are wearing, and then adds further criteria that rules out most other people. It then fails to take into account research that shows that cotton masks become saturated with exhaled moisture and perspiration, and that stops their filtering properties. It also fails to take into account reductions in social distancin…

I'm pretty fed up of people acting so incredibly arrogant. Unless you can show evidence that wearing a mask is dangerous, and makes things worse, then just wear a mask. Stop trying to find reasons to prove everyone wrong. Some data someone else in the thread posted: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24952278

The Surgeon General said back in March that wearing masks increases the chance of spreading covid because people aren't trained on how to use them correctly and it gives them a false sense of security.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/02/health/surgeon-general-corona...

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#58

Post by Monroe13 »

URfejk wrote: post #35

More stuff on masks: A visual demonstration why masks don't work: https://videopress.com/v/4egEyh2b We did not identify any experimental volunteer studies that investigated whether surgical masks or N95 respirators could protect against infection: https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-inf... Face mask use in health care workers has not been demonstrated to provide benefit in terms of cold symptoms…

From the summary of your second link... “ There is some evidence to support the wearing of masks or respirators during illness to protect others, and public health emphasis on mask wearing during illness may help to reduce influenza virus transmission.”

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#59

Post by davak »

I'm a critical care doc and directly involved with COVID administrative policies for my health system organization. I have recently told friends and family to start buying and wearing medical masks. Our experience is that medical masks are very protective in protecting the wearer from catching the disease. Hospitals have plenty of masks now. A cloth mask prevents spread away from the wearer, but a medical mask protects both the wearer and those around him/her.

Medical masks protect in two ways. One, they filter the air at an extremely high level. Two, they are fluid resistant, so the saliva droplets that are filled with virus particles cannot penetrate the mask.

Most health organizations, including mine, are noticing that COVID prevalence within their employees is less than the local population as a whole despite being around contagious COVID patients all day long. The major difference in these two populations is that health care workers are wearing medical masks.

Re: Masks Work. Really. We’ll Show You How

#60

Post by 762236 »

DanBC wrote: post #18

The headline says "masks work", then the article redefines masks to exclude the things that many people are wearing, and then adds further criteria that rules out most other people. It then fails to take into account research that shows that cotton masks become saturated with exhaled moisture and perspiration, and that stops their filtering properties. It also fails to take into account reductions in social distancin…

I read the same article as you. They did not redefine masks, nor add further criteria. They chose a model that applies to masks of any fiber and weave but with different filtration efficiencies.
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