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Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

reuters.com

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Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#101

Post by marketingPro »

henearkr wrote: post #65
cheph wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My references are previous posts on HN or on phys.org as you can easily search it. And you could cite a claim you are making. Without numbers it is hard to say if this is a good basis for decisions.

The statistics are in the making, and researchers discover more illness mechanisms each day. As I said, we are in the presence of a huge risk and there is no "reassuring numbers" anywhere to counterbalance that. As one reference on the risks I'm speaking of, here is an article about the action of the virus on the nerve cells: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-we-know-so-f... By the way, between "relying…

Suicide, abuse/trauma, avoided medical treatments, drug and alcohol addictions, and depression have all been seen to increase since we first had lockdowns.

There is no safe solution, it's a decision between protecting the 0.5% old, obese, and sick or the 99.5%

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#102

Post by Neil44 »

barry-cotter wrote: post #99
dbetteridge wrote: post #3

OK, someone tell me why this isn't the good news it sounds like

Because by the time this passes clinical trials the Chinese vaccine will have been in mass production for months. The FDA will delay adoption of any vaccine in the US for many months in order to keep to the same standards they use when the world isn’t on fire.

It's already in production pending approval, which is set to be fast tracked to "save christmas"

Personally I would argue that the standards should be kept to even when the world is on fire, I mean they do exist for a reason.

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#103

Post by gadders »

input_sh wrote: post #62
calvinv wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if we're back to normalish by spring next year I think that would be a great outcome, if the messaging to the public would be, buckle down until then I think lockdown complaince could go up

I think you're vastly overestimating our capacity to build enough vaccines and distribute them over the world, as well as dealing with those who will refuse to vaccinate. Even if we had a vaccine ready for the roll-out today, I don't see us going back to normalish until late 2021 at earliest. As with any vaccine, you'd need about 80% of the population to vaccinate in order for herd immunity to kick in. I feel like we…

Given the low fatality rate for COVID, wouldn't you just want to concentrate vaccination on those most at risk? i.e. the elderly, people with underlying conditions etc.

You don't need to eradicate the virus, just stop it affecting the most vulnerable. Everybody else can then carry on as normal (albeit with a slight chance of getting a nasty flu-like illness).

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#105

Post by tpm »

jlokier wrote: post #18
arethuza wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems fair if they are being expected to rush the development of the vaccine?

It's fair if the degree of disclaiming is proportionate to the need and the pace. They shouldn't be off the hook completely. They should still have to show they have conducted a responsible level of testing and checking for the circumstances, that they are continuing to refine that verification even after widespread deployment, and to motivate that to be done all levels requires some degree of moral hazard remains in…

That's the responsibility of the FDA, EMA etc., to make sure all of the above is met. However to be open to vaccine injury claims, in the current societal climate (lots of malicious actos and antivaccine disinformation among the public), would risk the financial viability of vaccine makers. That's a longtime problem in the US (hence some of the vaccine makers are protected by the National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act) and other countries.

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#106

Post by treeman79 »

lbeltrame wrote: post #19
dbetteridge wrote: post #3

OK, someone tell me why this isn't the good news it sounds like

Glass half full: We can measure an immune response also in populations where it's more difficult to get a decent one. An immune response means that the immune system actually is taking action against the viral antigen. Glass half empty: We don't know how the immune response measured relates to protection from or lessening of the infection. This is what the ongoing trial is trying to find out. This is, IIRC, the secon…

I have at least one autoimmune disorder.

There are tests that can be run to show an immune response.

One thing I’ve learned is it’s extremely hard to get doctors to run the tests. AND there are a whole lot of them. AND I’ve run into many doctors that are 10-20 years out of date with treatment and diagnosis protocols.

As in, current recommendations are that test X isn’t reliable. Use test Y. Doctor refuses to run any test because you’re the wrong gender. AND The moment you see someone in a practice your banned from seeing anyone else in the practice. So second opinion means going to 20 miles to another center.

Oh, and it’s 3 months+ to get a single appointment. You may need two dozen appointments until they narrow in on the issue.

That something is possible still leaves a massive gap of getting it done.

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#107

Post by jonathanstrange »

throwaway4good wrote: post #66

All these hundreds of vaccines that are being developed; are they all triggering the same immune response?

No. AFAIK, they may target different proteins on the virus hull and also differ in other respects among each other. Some of them might be less effective than others, some might be more prone to being rendered ineffective by virus mutations than others, there can be substantial differences in the number of complications caused by vaccination, and some of them could also cause problems with developing future vaccines for deadly coronavirus variants that may occur another time.

At least, that's how I understand it from what I've heard. Others should please correct me if I'm wrong.

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#108

Post by rimliu »

celticninja wrote: post #74
rimliu wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is immunity from infection questionable? We had 43 million cases and about a dozen or so reinfections. Not sure if confirmed reinfections reach the double digits yet.

Read the papers on it, antibody tests in people who have previously tested positive for covid have found little or no antibodies in tests taken 3 months after infection. So it appears as if there is a limited/short term immunity after initial infection. The vaccine appears to produce a much stronger immune response, such that antibodies can be identified in tests some time after the vaccination. You can get limited i…

There are more immune mechanizms beside antibodies (T-cells, B-cells). For the common cold there are different viruses, so you may get a cold caused by different ones.

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#109

Post by ulfw »

karma_fountain wrote: post #13
dbetteridge wrote: post #3

OK, someone tell me why this isn't the good news it sounds like

It is good news if true, but we are rushing the trials of a new vaccine and then potentially going to give it to a large number of people. What if the vaccine has long term negative effects?

What if Covid-19 has long term negative effects?

Re: Vaccine hopes rise as Oxford jab prompts immune response among old and young

#110

Post by kuu »

calvinv wrote: post #32
erikrothoff wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“The programme is progressing well, (but) we’re not there yet,” Hancock said. Looking good, but still months away from rolling out.

if we're back to normalish by spring next year I think that would be a great outcome, if the messaging to the public would be, buckle down until then I think lockdown complaince could go up

Let's see, because the vaccination probably requires two shots per person with probably 6-8 months in between, so it will take time...
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