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Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

reuters.com

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Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#111

Post by dheera »

tinus_hn wrote: post #22

The big question is what Russia has to gain from this. Is it just to troll the US?

I'd think this isn't just a PR move, but his technical knowledge would probably be an asset to Russia, or any country for that matter. He'd be the perfect candidate to create a thriving startup, increase Russia's GDP, and create thousands of jobs. Or assist Russia's government in identifying threats from foreign cyber-spying.

What country wouldn't want highly skilled and knowledgeable people in STEM to immigrate, thrive, and boost the country's economy? Oh right, the US.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#112

Post by jboog »

fandroid wrote: post #52

Due to the extent of mil intelligence docs stolen, and since the domestic programs deployed were lawful at the time, whistleblower is a disingenuious title for Mr. Snowden. Putting aside domestic disclosures, it's difficult to see how the scope of stolen materials merits praise or euphemistic titles. Snowden is a fugitive. As it pertains to the majority of what was stolen, he is not a whistleblower, but a thief. Had…

Yeah, he could have selectively leaked only important crimes of the US government but he instead leaked tons of shit that endangered the lives of Americans overseas and gave our enemies insight into how we conduct intelligence gathering in hostile countries.

Add that to his shady Russia ties and he's not the hero many make him out to be.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#113

Post by classified »

dang wrote: post #67
classified wrote: post #40

The Greatest Country On Earth™ has its citizens flee to the Empire Of Evil™ just so they can speak a simple truth without being imprisoned or called a traitor. The incompetent bureaucrats in charge of Snowden's prosecution made him a martyr instead. Those people are massive fuckups even at playing bad guys and you trust them to operate an Orwellian surveillance and suppression system? Good luck with that.

" Please don't fulminate. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Perhaps you don't owe massive fuckups better, but you owe this community better if you're posting here. We're trying for a different sort of conversation.

I have to confess that I didn't put much energy in filtering this. In the future I will endeavor to exhibit more decorum.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#114

Post by duxup »

malandrew wrote: post #100
duxup wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not convinced Russia has any allegiance to "the truth" outside of when it intersects what they happen to want to say at the moment. I would consider Russia far more Orwellian than most nations. Comparisons like yours seem to ignore that fact.

You're probably right, but if it takes two orwellian actors exposing the orwellian nature of one another to mitigate how much orwell we experience in the US and russians experience in Russia, I'd consider that a net win for civil liberties in both countries.

I'm VERY wary of granting anyone pretty far down the Orwellian hole any credibility when it comes to the idea that they might help anyone determine the truth / dig another nation out of an Orwellian hole.

Straight up I don't think they want that, actually the opposite.

Russia really seems to prefer to get close up with other Orwellian nations more than others, they're not there to help ANYONE dig out, rather they'd rather just get friends in place in other nations that are Orwellian themselves.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#115

Post by fandroid »

btbuildem wrote: post #92
fandroid wrote: post #52

Due to the extent of mil intelligence docs stolen, and since the domestic programs deployed were lawful at the time, whistleblower is a disingenuious title for Mr. Snowden. Putting aside domestic disclosures, it's difficult to see how the scope of stolen materials merits praise or euphemistic titles. Snowden is a fugitive. As it pertains to the majority of what was stolen, he is not a whistleblower, but a thief. Had…

Had Snowden simply revealed unconstitutional domestic mass surveillance programs, he'd be labeled as a conspiracy theorist at best. I imagine the data he took were to serve as proof of these governmental over-reaches. Nobody would've taken him seriously without solid proof.

He could have stolen only the docs related to domestic surveillance. Snowden could have handed only those docs to his media handlers who would then vet them with the IC.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#116

Post by DubiousPusher »

ciarannolan wrote: post #71

If granted a pardon by the current or future US president, is there any chance that Russia will not let him return home?

Considering that this is mostly about Russia doing a victory lap, I don't think so.

If they tried to keep him there it would kind of spoil the whole thing and tip the lie of their supposed benevolence.

Much better for the PR to let him go and wish him luck. Probably even have a send off ceremony, give him some kind of medal?

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#117

Post by colejohnson66 »

solarkraft wrote: post #62
0df8dkdf wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pardon Snowden and Assange. Let all the dirt about all the high level people come out no matter how dark dirty or ugly they are, only then does US can start to establish some legitimacy on the world stage.

Something tells me that the high level people wouldn't like that.

Yep. Obama didn’t even pardon Manning. He only commuted her sentence. The difference being that pardoning removes it from your record while commuted is just “time served.”

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#118

Post by seppin »

class4behavior wrote: post #64
seppin wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it's call a "cover story". He visited the Russian consulate in HK (for a birthday party no less) before he left and his main legal advisor was the lawyer from Wikileaks , a Russian intel cutout. All just coincidence I guess.

It was a consulate, you genius, and he spent several days there. He must be a moron if he expected that would stay secret. You do realize especially with his situation, he had to cover all legal aspects. Anyone would visit the consulate before traveling to Russia, and he would, too, even if he didn't plan to leave the international zone. Staying Russia wasn't his plan, but it was definitely an option as he must've kn…

People are (still, amazingly) claiming he just happened to get stranded in Russia. Clearly this was either his backup plan for what most likely would happen, or his actual plan for what he knew would happen (with Russian intel advising him the whole way).

Pretty far away from "do people not realize that his passport was taken and he got stuck in the Moscow airport?" Really far.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#119

Post by slg »

shadowgovt wrote: post #109
slg wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just like Chelsea Manning has and will continue to spend the rest of her life in prison?

The US's treatment of Manning has sent the very clear signal that the next person who wants to leak classified documents had better have a speedboat to Vladivostok waiting for them.

I obviously don't think Manning was treated well, but she is an clear example that Snowden wasn't facing "a guaranteed life sentence". Being overly hyperbolic does nothing but lessen the perceived severity of a punishment that would already appear extreme if stated completely honestly.

Re: Russia gives Edward Snowden permanent residency

#120

Post by Matticus_Rex »

whateveracct wrote: post #110
seppin wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Russia can come off like the benevolent country protecting freedom. Not even the most devoted partisan can claim this was a straight face. Russia kills journalists that speak against Putin, poison political opposition, and paint with microwave radiation any diplomat misguided enough to attempt a dialogue. It's a mafia state, pure and simple.

HN contrarians don't wanna hear that - they routinely gobble up the narrative that the US is less free than Russia and other autocracies.

I don't think anyone here is saying that the US is less free than Russia. They're saying that this move has PR to that effect as one of its goals.
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