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White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

theguardian.com

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Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#71

Post by Reason077 »

blain_the_train wrote: post #63
bookofjoe wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good point. I'm surprised they don't offer a noise-canceling option.

Because noise cancelling only works on constant noise. So if you use it at sleep time, load sudden noises will seem more alarming.

> “noise cancelling only works on constant noise.”

That’s not true. While it won’t completely cancel sharp, sudden, very loud sounds, it will significant reduce their intensity.

It’s easy to miss someone talking to you, or knocking on your door, for example, when wearing NC headphones.

The Sony headphone software has settings to adjust the intensity of blocking for different kinds of sounds (such as voices, or traffic sounds).

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#72

Post by musicale »

mleonhard wrote: post #67
closeparen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes I feel like an alien when people suggest earplugs for noise problems. Maybe I just process sound very differently. Earplugs succeed at exactly one task: attenuating dangerous sound levels down to comfortable ones. The don't reduce the amount of information. A 30dB conversation is exactly as distracting as a 60dB conversation. I also have custom fitted IEMs that provide similar attenuation. These are equally…

Which earplugs did you try and what is their frequency attenuation? If they are designed for musicians, they may attenuate all frequencies equally. I often sleep with Ohropax foam earplugs. They eliminate the high frequencies like sirens. They reduce the mid-range and low frequencies, too. Conversation becomes muffled quiet mumbling. Noises can transmit through the frame of the frame of the building, my bed frame, my…

>I'm not distracted by my body's internal sounds

You are very lucky.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#73

Post by musicale »

pmiller2 wrote: post #51
bradlys wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure where I heard it but I've heard that wearing earplugs for prolonged periods isn't good either. Beyond that, I don't like the feeling (even of the putty ones) after a few hours. My ears start to feel clammy and like I'm building some kind of bacteria dish inside my ear. Ear plugs have never been enough for me. Also - if it gets too quiet then my tinnitus starts going. Thus, like OP, I use a fan. Bothers m…

I've always just thought it was ridiculous that I should have to wear ear plugs to sleep in my own home. Why do people tolerate that? (I know, that's apartment living for you, etc. , but not all apartments are that way.)

It is bizarre and insane, but cities seem uninterested in reducing noise pollution from ground transport, machinery, aircraft, sirens and emergency vehicles, etc..

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#74

Post by ldeangelis »

Some anecdotal data: I sometimes sleep with a white noise machine (the Dohm from Yogasleep). When I sleep with it, I usually remember my dreams way better (I feel like I had multiple dreams that night compared to almost none usually). I can't really say if I sleep better or not, but it helps me fall asleep quicker if the neighbors are making noise at night.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#75

Post by graeme »

ry454 wrote: post #68
graeme wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh, I hadn’t realized but apparently some of the causes can be trouble. If you or anyone reading this any possibility of cardiac issues (high blood pressure, clogged arteries), it would be worth mentioning at your next checkup. Mine was pretty clearly linked to an injury that eventually caused other tinnitus so I assumed the causes were similar. Note that per the link below pulsatile tinnitus can be quite benign, bu…

I won't be surprised if FFT of tinnitus, if we could make one, reveals a very accurate picture of the patient's health.

Fft?

And why is that, since the causes are so varied and often specific?

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#76

Post by burntoutfire »

graeme wrote: post #64
mattgreenrocks wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve never heard about CO2 contributing to sleep issues. What did you do to diagnose and remediate this?

Oh, I’m not OP but I forgot to add that the standard remediations are pretty simple: airflow. Open a door and open a window. Pretty much nothing else does it, though an air exchanger in a home ventilation system can help. This of course can get complicated by light (the door), sound (door and window), pollution (window) and heat/cold (window). So your local setup may vary. In my own case the big challenge is winter.…

> In my own case the big challenge is winter. But usually just a small crack is enough to lower co2 a fair bit during the cold season.

Yep - I open a window in another room of my apartment, and the brownian motion air exchange (as both rooms have no doors) is enough to keep CO2 at around 600 ppm through the night. Without it, it'd probably shoot to over 2000 ppm over the night.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#77

Post by Reason077 »

amelius wrote: post #30
Reason077 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are not (active) noise cancelling!

Perhaps try noise-cancelling speakers instead of headphones. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_M6G0gsTtmY https://www.silentium.com/

This is a really interesting technology. If it were packaged in an actual consumer-oriented product (and wasn't insanely expensive) I'd definitely give it a try.

One of the main annoying noises I have to deal with is the constant hum/rumble from a ventilation fan on the roof of my building. Seems like exactly the sort of problem that a noise-cancelling speaker could solve.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#78

Post by mattgreenrocks »

burntoutfire wrote: post #76
graeme wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, I’m not OP but I forgot to add that the standard remediations are pretty simple: airflow. Open a door and open a window. Pretty much nothing else does it, though an air exchanger in a home ventilation system can help. This of course can get complicated by light (the door), sound (door and window), pollution (window) and heat/cold (window). So your local setup may vary. In my own case the big challenge is winter.…

> In my own case the big challenge is winter. But usually just a small crack is enough to lower co2 a fair bit during the cold season. Yep - I open a window in another room of my apartment, and the brownian motion air exchange (as both rooms have no doors) is enough to keep CO2 at around 600 ppm through the night. Without it, it'd probably shoot to over 2000 ppm over the night.

Interesting, I might try this.

As someone with seasonal allergies, I've often been surprised at how serenely I'd sleep with a window open.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#79

Post by senorsmile »

musicale wrote: post #72
mleonhard wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which earplugs did you try and what is their frequency attenuation? If they are designed for musicians, they may attenuate all frequencies equally. I often sleep with Ohropax foam earplugs. They eliminate the high frequencies like sirens. They reduce the mid-range and low frequencies, too. Conversation becomes muffled quiet mumbling. Noises can transmit through the frame of the frame of the building, my bed frame, my…

>I'm not distracted by my body's internal sounds You are very lucky.

I use the solid sleepplugs from sensaphonics: https://www.sensaphonics.com/collections/plugs-sleeves/produ...

They are molded to my exact ears. I have tried several other ear plugs, and none of them come close to the level of isolation, including normal custom IEM's. Sometimes things are a little too loud (e.g. neighbors that won't quit on 4th of july at 2am), so adding white noise helps smooth things over.

I will say that I can very clearly hear my breathing with these in, as well as my heart beat sometimes. It's sometimes that bothered me for a couple of nights, but now it's quite comforting.

Re: White noise as sleep aid may do more harm than good, say scientists

#80

Post by nonamenoslogan »

Vaslo wrote: post #7

I use a machine built just for this purpose. It’s a fan that stays on until morning. I cannot have a restful sleep without it - if someone in the house coughs or a slightly louder car drives by, ill be awake. Then I’ll spend part of the night worrying about things like a financial result at work or whether or not I locked the basement door.

This is my solution too--bonus the fan covers up the sound of my Labrador retrievers licking themselves in the middle of the night (which wakes me out of a dead sleep every time).
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