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Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

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Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#221

Post by grishka »

crazygringo wrote: post #135
bobthepanda wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One possible option that never gets discussed is to nuke the amplification methods. If we stop recommending content automatically this ceases to be a problem.

They are nuking them right now (temporarily). It's not just being discussed, it's being done . But most of the time people like getting content recommended. It's what consumers want.

As someone who's worked at a big social media company — no, that's not at all what consumers want. They want chronological feeds with zero garbage mixed in. It's okay to have a separate recommendations feed, some (not all!) people want to discover new things, but it's totally not okay to meddle with the main one, and it's nothing but mockery to give users no control over it. People also want their preferences respected, they certainly don't want them reset every now and then.

The only reason people keep using services like Twitter is because their network keeps them there.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#222

Post by hyperdunc »

RIMR wrote: post #181

I think using the word "disputed" is a big mistake. It implies that a lie has some validity and that there's actual public disagreement. There's nothing wrong with taking a side between truth and lies. Even their example tweet should be clearly labeled as wrong, not "disputed". There is no serious dispute, only bad-faith political attacks against the democratic process.

What if those of bad faith get to decide what is true? The word "disputed" at least acknowledges that objectivity is very difficult.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#223

Post by bredren »

panopticon wrote: post #206
bredren wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people will stop watering their lawns during a drought. But they usually start up again after it passes.

I'm not sure if this statement is supportive of Twitter's decision or opposing the practice of not using drought-resistant landscaping.

People do things for themselves that to others appear wrong and unnecessarily self self-serving.

When presented with major societal issues some people are reasonable enough to trim it back until the crisis has subsided.

I think Twitter and Facebook’s coddling enablement of President Trump has been disgusting and both companies have morally bankrupt business models.

But in 2020, you no sooner can demand your neighbor not keep a lush green lawn than you can a social network not run an ad network.

At least this pattern of making the change when it is having its worst impact is better than no change at all.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#224

Post by hyperdunc »

troughway wrote: post #139

From the top: From Facebook's point of view, we have recently learned that the whole circus around Cambridge Analytica was a gigantic farce and that they had no more access to anything than anyone else - and that they hardly did anything with it to begin with. 2016 taught us that even if everyone puts their chips on one candidate, and says that they have a 99% chance of winning, it may not be a reflection of reality…

I think your point is valid but a condescending tone will probably stop it from being seriously considered.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#225

Post by tpmx »

konjin wrote: post #219
tpmx wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, Paul Graham, YC founder seems to agree with me: https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1310583298666696705 Edit: To clarify, he is saying the right way ahead for companies is to be apolitical, or, "mission-founded". Coinbase offered employees not comfortable with the non-political mission-founded way exit packages: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24636899

Those thoughts aren't welcome on HN any more.

As a European looking at this spectacle from a distance: SV is eating itself. Well, good for Europe, I guess.

Edit: but also good for China, and they're a lot better positioned to take advantage of this.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#226

Post by simias »

tpmx wrote: post #189
simias wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That makes no sense to me. Do you think social networks would be less toxic and less abused if all the devs at Facebook or Twitter were apolitical? How would that work? It's the quest for "engagement" and getting always more users and ad views that generates this situation. What can be used to sell you shoes and earphones can also be used to sell you political ideas. When the algorithm wants to show you some inflamma…

Well, Paul Graham, YC founder seems to agree with me: https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1310583298666696705 Edit: To clarify, he is saying the right way ahead for companies is to be apolitical, or, "mission-founded". Coinbase offered employees not comfortable with the non-political mission-founded way exit packages: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24636899

I don't see how that has anything to do with the topic at hand. We're not talking about Twitter's success, we're talking about its influence on elections. If anything it's because it's been very successful (by some metrics) that it's in this position.

I'm not saying that an ultra-politicized workplace can't be an issue, I'm saying that it's silly to blame this particular problem on it. The very concept of ad-supported social networks is the issue, not the political alignment of the guy who writes the CSS.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#227

Post by sangnoir »

ValentineC wrote: post #211
tomjakubowski wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can tap the sparkly icon on the feed and change to "Latest Tweets".

Wow, thanks, this seems to work for now.

You are right to say "for now" - the app will periodically force you back to "Home" view (after a seemingly random period) and then you have to manually switch back - I'm guessing Home view has better "engagement" metrics for the Twitter suits.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#228

Post by konjin »

tpmx wrote: post #225
konjin wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those thoughts aren't welcome on HN any more.

As a European looking at this spectacle from a distance: SV is eating itself. Well, good for Europe, I guess. Edit: but also good for China, and they're a lot better positioned to take advantage of this.

As a citizen of the world with several passports including a US one: this happens every 10 years. The last time was conservatives doing it so people are shocked that liberals are just as insular. The 90s PC culture wars are a thing that went in the memory hole really fast when Clinton needed the women who were accusing him to be sluts and harlots again.

On the bright side social media is becoming so unbearable that we'll see more decentralization. It's hard to get banned from a forum when you run an instance of it yourself. And hard not to be when they are run by the mentally ill who think that saying crazy is a bannable offense for being ableist.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#229

Post by iso947 »

reaperducer wrote: post #200
throwaway316943 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it suspect that they are giving as one of their criteria for calling the election as two authoritative news sources independently calling it. If this were non partisan they would have at least said a majority of authoritative sources or some other consensus.

Then you run into the problem of "What is authoritative?" By limiting it to just two, Twitter can say, "We like these guys. They're reputable." Instead of having to line up and vet thousands of other sources, and task people with monitoring all those thousands of authoritative sources around the world.

I’ve never understood the dewy beats Truman calling system. In the UK each constituency announces results after being counted (and recounted). Those results arrive during the night, polls close at 10, first results at 11, a good idea of who will win in most elections by 5, andthe last few results might stretch into 9 or 10 am if ferries are having issues.

But aside from a national exit poll at 10pm, there are no real guesses.

It seems that different US elections predict who will win a given state far earlier in the process - before the votes are counted even the first time. Is that right?

My own global broadcaster takes its “calls” from ABC. I think that abc, nbc, cbs, Fox, cnn, New York Times and Washington post are probably good enough for “calling it”. I was working election night 2012 in our Washington office and was shocked how early the “Obama wins” straps went up -I have a photo at just 23:19 eastern from fox saying Obama was re-elected. That’s something like 4 hours before polls close in Alaska and Hawaii!

If 4 of those networks and papers have called it then it’s likely good. Sure there’s buzzfeed and whatever that may have enough professional staff on to really judge it, but it’s unlikely that 3 networks and a major paper are all going to call Dewy rather than Truman.

Re: Additional steps we're taking ahead of the 2020 US Election

#230

Post by sangnoir »

konjin wrote: post #218
isk517 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Welcome to the future, where we must chose between either drowning in a sea of misinformation or sustaining ourselves on a puddle of information that a "benevolent" third-party has deemed safe.

[flagged]

Your first sentence seems at odds with the second one.
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