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A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

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651–660 of 774 posts

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#651

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the problem is really about politicization and more specifically the fact that in most US tech companies there is an enormous bias towards those on the political left, and a believe that those who lean left are more “scientifically educated” or intelligent or well-read, etc. As one example you can see it in the way you can make hostile comments about “straight white males” and nobody says anything, but if you wer…

I don't think it's a numerical bias. Rather the extreme left are just hyper-aggressive in ways other parts of the spectrum aren't, especially libertarians are not aggressive and they were traditionally a big bloc inside tech firms. As for the belief that the left are intellectually superior, that's not specific to tech firms. You get empty slogans about being "reality-based" from the left in all walks of life. It's w…

> especially libertarians are not aggressive

Depends on the subgroup.

> As for the belief that the left are intellectually superior, that's not specific to tech firms.

IMHO, I feel this is an organic collusion of messaging. Like the boomers felt a little envious to Leftist ideas and it shows in how boomers are teaching future generations. I don't think this is intentional but there does seem to be an implicit shift in the writings that teach the youth. I grew up in the public education system and various books almost assume that Leftists are more critical thinkers. It could be a phrasing of a topic or a popular narrative that has taken root in the culture. Compound this overtime, you have a new generation that assumes the indirect messaging that they've been conditioned on.

In conclusion, I think you're getting a lot of downvotes for two reasons. 1. You're making grand/general statements without supportive points. 2. You are contrarian to the current zeitgeist. I happen to agree with your main points (sheep are sheep and wolves are making sheep frantic). I wish more people were critical thinkers.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#652
post #568

My company is becoming increasingly political and it's terrible. I'd gladly go work at a company where I didn't have to engage with endless political activism. If I want to hear everyone's opinions on everything, I'd find their facebook page or the HN usernames and follow them.

It was instructive to hear the discussions in a Russian-speaking developer community about this... how the current stuff going on in the big companies reminded the older generation of the performative ideological cheering going on at their workplaces back in the late Soviet times. Think about it this way - sometimes, you have to be on call and stay up till 5am because of some crappy code you didn't write, and it suck…

Right, but if alternatives exist, I could go work there instead.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#653
post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is a perfect example of why banning political speech in the workplace is a very good idea. Every workplace that I've worked in that tolerated political speech ended up with a highly vocal segment of people making statements that parallel this comment: proclaiming that only a certain stance on controversial issues is acceptable, and implying (or stating outright) that divergence from this orthodoxy amount…

> only a certain stance on controversial issues is acceptable, and implying (or stating outright) that divergence from this orthodoxy amounts to an affront to human dignity There are a variety of controversial issues where one position is a literal affront to human dignity (i.e., a deliberate act of disrespect). > This kind of rhetoric creates a hostile and toxic work environment This is a privileged view of the situ…

Statements that genuinely are an affront to human dignity are already prohibited under anti-harassment rules. Such positions are also rarely controversial: most people do not want to disrespect human dignity.

A substantial segment of people have realized that they can shut down any conflicting opinions on controversial issues by proclaiming that divergence from their orthodoxy amounts to an affront to human dignity. Over the course of my employment I've seen people claim:

* All positions must pursue at least 50% female representation, and anything less than that amounts to misogyny.

* Voting for the current president of the United States amounts to an act of overt racism.

* Opposing affirmative action amounts to overt racism.

* Supporting affirmative action amounts to overt racism.

These positions are not affronts to human dignity. Maybe some people genuinely do believe that it does, but their views are disconnected enough that it's no excuse:

* Say an anti-abortion activist genuinely does believe that terminating a pregnancy amounts to murder. I'm sure such a person would be deeply offended by someone who supports a woman's right to do so, and would see it as an affront to human dignity. Say they posted on Facebook to this effect, that abortion is murder and should be banned. A co-worker who has had an abortion complains to HR saying a co-worker accused them of murder because of their contraceptive decisions. No HR person worth their salt would take action in this case, since it's effectively firing ~30% of the population because of their political or religious beliefs. If you don't want to be exposed to your co-workers political views, don't friend them on Facebook and don't follow them on Twitter.

* Say Bob makes a tweet supporting affirmative action in hiring and promotion, and Lin (who is Asian and opposes affirmative action) sees this. She finds it an affront to her dignity and amounts to asking organizations to deprive her right to equal opportunity. Does Lin have grounds to ask the company to sanction Bob for openly espousing discrimination against her? If these statement were made in the workplace, maybe, but otherwise Lin should just not view Bob's out-of-work communications. The company's policy is to give equal opportunity to all races, and Lin has no proof that Bob brought his views into the workplace.

Crucially, though, these two examples occurred outside of the workplace. Had they occurred inside the workplace ,then they now have much stronger cases. Your co-workers are captive audiences, in the context of interactions in the office. If Bob says this to Lin in the office, Lin can't just block him.

As far as your example goes, If Taylor doesn't want to see Alex's political views Taylor should block Alex on Twitter. They're not a captive audience in this situation: there's zero reason why these two people need to see each other's tweets to do their job. But if Alex said this inside the office, then there'd be better grounds for taking action against Alex. That's why offices are increasingly telling co-workers to keep their politics out of the office.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#654
post #396
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has been discussed extensively in the previous threads on Coinbase, but banning the discussion of certain topics in the workplace is itself a political stance. Very much so.

It's as political as banning goofing off at work. You aren't hired to spend the working day debating politics with your co workers, just like you aren't hired to blow off the day playing Halo in the back room with your coworkers. You are hired to do the tasks described in your job and that alone.

I hire a whole person who, along with the company itself, exists in society and is not an automaton judged only by how many widgets are produced.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#655
post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This does seem to be the standard Libertarian worldview, but no matter how much you intend to ignore the world around you, it exists and you're a part of it, and you answer to your neighbors. One clever way to deeply entrench a political decision is to convince others that it's not a political decision at all. If you're successful, you've erected a barrier against your opponents by interfering with their ability to…

The opposite strategy is to talk about politics constantly, so that it's painfully obvious who's in the minority. Which is better for a gay man in Saudi Arabia? A company where people only talk about work, or a company where everybody is expected to take a stance on homosexuality?

> The opposite strategy is to talk about politics constantly, so that it's painfully obvious who's in the minority.

> Which is better for a gay man in Saudi Arabia? A company where people only talk about work, or a company where everybody is expected to take a stance on homosexuality?

You're talking about something completely different. What I'm talking about is basically falsely depoliticizing a political decision, so people think it's something that cannot be changed, like nature or something. The reference to Newspeak, which was imagined as a way of dismantling the mental machinery of political opposition, should have made that clear. That you missed it is ironic given your username.

If you want to map the experience of a gay man in Saudi Arabia onto what I was talking about, he would marry a woman and not even think things could be any different.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#656
post #560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me, "everything is political" is a bumper sticker version of the assertion that what is and isn't "political" in the sense of "political statement" is often way more subjective than we sometimes recognize it is. If a coworker talks about his husband, is that a political statement? To some people, absolutely, right? How about someone mentioning a concert that they've gone to, for an artist that's outspokenly politi…

To me, the deciding criteria is the intent of the person undertaking said action. Are they taking an action to express their allegiance to a political movement? Are they taking action to attempt to convince/recruit people to a cause they believe in? Or are they taking action not for such purposes? For example, a gay person talking about their spouse to a colleague without the intent to change any political beliefs of…

That seems like it'd be a tough standard to apply in practice -- how do you prove intent?

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#657
post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, so are black people supposed to just be fine with police killing them? I genuinely don’t understand at how you could arrive at that conclusion

Care to quote the part of the parent comment where he said anything remotely like that? This is obnoxious, dishonest, bullying.

I’m responding to “I believe that this movement has made our society more racist and divided than it was before.” Effectively this means the parent thinks that no movement should be made at all, ergo the status quo should continue. You can debate the merits of the demands that BLM puts forth but how on earth is this not implying that the protests in response to police killings are making society more racist?

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#658
post #648
post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this very view is likely what made the coinbase workplace so toxic and uninviting. "Black lives matter" is a statement that everyone already agrees with. "Black Lives Matter" is a political organization with political objectives, including the de-emphasis of the nuclear family, socialist economics, and explicit financial funnelling to the Democrat party. It's a moral "package deal." The idea being that if you…

> "Black lives matter" is a statement that everyone already agrees with. The fact that you believe that is probably most of the problem.

Oh come on. Have you ever tried to find one person who actually, literally believes that the lives of black people do not matter?

You'll certainly find 11-year olds in Call of Duty who will say it for shits and giggles to control you; you won't find anybody who actually believes it.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#659
post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Employment and stock-options are not "fractions of board seats". i agree that employment is not "fractions of board seats. But stock options (when converted to stock) holds voting power, and thus _do_ represent "factions of board seats". Very little amount, but an amount nonetheless.

Stock options are mostly for common stock, which don't give you voting power anyways.

Generally common stock has voting power.

Re: A follow up to Coinbase being a mission focused company

#660

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you underestimate how many people are fed up with overly politicized workplaces. I’ve quit a couple of jobs due to it. I’d definitely stay somewhere where I can just work without having to listen to unrelated BS constantly, even if it meant passing on a sweet severance package.

I haven't worked anywhere that ordinary politics was discussed. I'm in uk though. I'd find it rude for someone to shove their political views in my face. It's fine for friends to discuss as I choose my friends not my colleagues. What kinda of things are people talking about?

That's the difference. For a lot of Californian tech companies, the whole company meetings revolve less around strategy and mission and more about racial inequality and Trump. As an outsider, I can't understand how strong the bubble is and how lacking in context these people are.
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