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Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

vrfinal.com

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Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#121

Post by dannyw »

sida wrote: post #109
liamwire wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Critically, if I want to use a smartwatch with an iPhone, I’m not limited to the Apple Watch.

But the analogy here is that if you buy Apple Watch, it is reasonable that it is tied tk iPhone. just like you are buying oculus quest knowing that it is tied to FB

There are legitimate and practical reasons for tying an Apple Watch (hardware) to an iPhone (hardware).

You can also use both without an Apple account.

As an analogy, this is like Geico insurance requiring you to sign up for a United MileagePlus account because Berkshire Hathway owns both (hypothetically).

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#122

Post by polyomino »

sova wrote: post #84
polyomino wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the core function of a product should be up to the people making it, not congress.

Not if your product is harassing people by phone or something annoyingly similar. The line blurs and moves often.

Yeah, fair. The congress should go after robocalling spammers.

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#123

Post by Digit-Al »

sida wrote: post #109
liamwire wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Critically, if I want to use a smartwatch with an iPhone, I’m not limited to the Apple Watch.

But the analogy here is that if you buy Apple Watch, it is reasonable that it is tied tk iPhone. just like you are buying oculus quest knowing that it is tied to FB

I don't own any Apple products personally but I would say that the difference is that an Apple Watch is specifically sold as an accessory to your iPhone. You wouldn't, for example, buy an X-Box controller and expect it to work with a Playstation.

On the other hand, the Oculus is not an accessory to Facebook it is a platform for playing games.

People had no problem with tying their Oculus to an account, to manage their purchases, etc.., but people do have a problem with being forced to have it tied to a social media account.

I would say the difference here is that when we create a social media account we know, to a degree, that we are making a Faustian pact to have our data harvested in exchange for free services. But the Oculus is actually purchased with real money so we don't expect to have our privacy violated so the company can make even more money off us by harvesting our personal data.

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#125

Post by Digit-Al »

ericd wrote: post #100
sprite wrote: post #55

I pre ordered one then realized the fb login requirement and cancelled it. Wonder how many are in the same boat.

I'm sure there are a bunch in the same boat. I owned Oculus' DK1 and DK2, but when I thought through what FB owning Oculus meant, I cancelled my original Rift preorder and bought a Vive instead. More recently, my resolve against letting FB get their data proboscis into my life was weakening with the Quest 2 launch. Fortunately, they came up with that forceful reminder of why I made that decision in the first place.

I know what you mean. I have no problem owning and using a Facebook account, but that's my choice and I choose what to share. I don't know about you but when I first heard that Facebook had acquired Oculus my first thought was something along the lines of "Oh FFS".

In my opinion, if I pay money for a product I don't expect to have my privacy violated so I can be further monetised. The point of a Facebook account is I have made a deal that I will allow information about my use of the product to be used as payment for the product. That is not the case for something I have already paid for.

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#126

Post by monadic2 »

softwaredoug wrote: post #22

The problem with antitrust enforcement w/ Big Tech will be users actually want vertical integration in a lot of contexts. And this vertical integration aligns consumers with the large tech companies in a way that hasn't been true with previous antitrust cases. Yes we could have more open standards, but the cartesian product of every integration eventually doesn't scale. What Microsoft did with Windows in this regard…

How do you have any clue what users want? How are you confident that what you value is what others value? I suspect most people are informed what they want via commercials and would probably be open to other ways of integrating electronics and services than the ones beneficial to the few players we all know and use.

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#127

Post by ben_w »

culturestate wrote: post #61
save_ferris wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tangentially related: newly-created Facebook accounts are a whole lot harder to keep up these days if you’re just using them for a single purpose, like following events. I created an account last year to get more socially involved in my community but I didn’t want to post any personal information and my account kept getting disabled unless I added pictures and filled out certain sections of my profile. Not sure if it…

I don't use FB personally, but I needed access to Business Manager for some client work so I created an account using my work email and tried to sign up for BM. They immediately locked the account, asked for a copy of my ID, and then permanently banned that account after I provided it . I have no idea why, there's no mechanism for appeal, and I can't even submit a request to have the image of my ID removed because th…

> I can't even submit a request to have the image of my ID removed because that form is gated behind the account.

This sounds like the sort of problem GDPR can solve. Are you in the EU, or the UK, or a place with equivalent provisions for allowing people to require business to show them what information they store, edit that info if it is wrong, and delete that info?

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#128

Post by Dylan16807 »

millstone wrote: post #94
Dylan16807 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can make a TV smart for $30. The difference between standalone and tethered headsets is a wide gulf.

But you bought "a TV". Likewise you buy "a VR headset."

TVs all have basically the same capabilities, or you can fix that for a very small amount of money.

VR Headsets don't share that quality, with wired vs. standalone.

An analogy would be having exactly one manufacturer that makes 3D TVs. They have market dominance there; it's not just "a TV".

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#129

Post by unishark »

save_ferris wrote: post #19

> The report states that, “conditioning access to a product or service in which a firm has market power to the use of a separate product or service is anticompetitive.” I agree with this. I shouldn’t have to have a social media account in order to use a product that isn’t directly related to social media. Accounts like Microsoft aren’t the same as Facebook IMO because they tie products and services I’ve purchased to…

The issue isn't with being forced to use social media, it's being forced to use only facebook's network. Privacy is a separate issue. They could just make Oculus also connect to other social networks including facebook's competition. Then the anticompetitive complaint is gone as Oculus's market share no longer gives Facebook an advantage. Yet the creepy privacy-violating continues more than ever. Sort of like IOS and Android, where no matter which option you choose for various apps to perform functions with your phone, you probably get tracked, most of it ending up at Facebook and Google anyway.

Re: Report may suggest that login requirement for Oculus Quest 2 is anticompetitive

#130

Post by jobigoud »

jcrawfordor wrote: post #86

It seems to me that the fundamental difference between this and other platforms that require login is this: for Facebook, having an account is the product. Facebook has designed everything about the Facebook experience to funnel users from registration to "engagement," and this is their main line of business and revenue source. Anything Facebook does to require someone to have an account is also forcing them to be a…

There is already a concept of Oculus account that works well, created mine in 2013. Linking this Oculus account to a Facebook account should be an option for people that are interested in using social aspects of VR, access to that link should be a permission grantable on a per-application basis.

Since there is already an account system that works it's impossible and bad faith for them to pretend it's mandatory to use a different product accounts.

Why can't they keep their hands away like for Instagram and Whatsapp?

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