Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

nypost.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

201–210 of 328 posts

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#201

Post by clairity »

tedivm wrote: post #151
clairity wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nyc and other municipalities really bungled the categorization of risk. restaurants and bars shouldn't have been lumped together in the first place. most restaurants could have employed some modest measures and stayed open at 80-90% capacity (which may be below break-even for some, but probably enough to ride out the pandemic with price hikes and/or modest gov loans), as risk is isolated between tables (no, that one…

What you are saying doesn't seem to be the reality. Studies show that there is in fact risk beyond just your table. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6936a5.htm?s_cid=mm... https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19/88543

the researchers' recommendation:

> "'Implementing safe practices to reduce exposures to SARS-CoV-2 during on-site eating and drinking should be considered to protect customers, employees, and communities and slow the spread of COVID-19,' Fisher and colleagues concluded."

which is exactly in line with opening restaurants with modest measures.

the study only provided impetus to look closer at restaurants as potentially not insignificant localities of spread due to self-reports citing slightly higher restaurant patronage in the 2 weeks prior. they declined to put forth any conclusions on prevalence or mechanisms for spread in restaurants because they didn't study those things. they only presented some statistics on the self-reports. that's it.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#202

Post by just-juan-post »

watwut wrote: post #172
just-juan-post wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people are scared and won't go to restaurants and bars then why continue to keep them closed? You are saying that patronage is already down so why even restrict them? Give people and businesses a choice in the matter. This is about letting individuals and businesses make their own decisions without the government forcing them to close.

> If people are scared and won't go to restaurants If people are responsible and won't go to restaurants ... Or long form: If people know there is infectious disease around with asymptomatic transmission and rationally decide not to go to restaurant to ... Framing does a lot.

> If people are responsible and won't go to restaurants

See here's the thing: Just because you and others like you have a certain definition of "responsible" doesn't mean it should or does apply to everyone.

Should we ban skydiving because it's irresponsible? Condom-less sex?

This is about choice. Re-open and let people and businesses choose.

Have a laugh with me tonight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXWhbUUE4ko

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#204

Post by alecco »

pfisch wrote: post #67
paxys wrote: post #58

It's ridiculous that we couldn't coordinate a rent/mortgage forgiveness plan alongside all the customer bans put in place across the country. If a restaurant can't stay open, they shouldn't pay rent. If the property owner isn't getting rent, they shouldn't have to pay mortgage. And so on, up the entire chain.

When you go up that chain you will eventually run into a very serious monetary crisis that would crash the banks, the real estate market, and the entire economy.

Banks will never, ever get caught with bad debt again. They learned the lesson in 2008. There's even regulation blocking that. This will be "dumb money" so our pensions and government funds. These take ratings agencies at face value and have no nuance and very slow to move on news like GP's feel-good idea.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#205

Post by sooheon »

refurb wrote: post #147
mjevans wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those seeking rents should be where the buck stops in a paused economy.

Collecting rents is not the same as "rent seeking".

When it comes to land ownership, I'm pretty sure the two are equivalent.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#206

Post by hinkley »

brutusborn wrote: post #169
hinkley wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you think restaurants are for? It sounds like you think they’re a scam.

BTW, why do you send such a hostile response without trying to answer my question? I genuinely just wanted to understand the Parent.

Frustration in a time of triage. You don’t discuss Philosophy or process while a patient is bleeding out in the table. We should be copycatting solutions we’ve already hashed out before.

As others have also asked, why are we discussing this now instead of six months ago? If we had anyone with any leadership in either the Legislative or Executive Branch of the Federal government, we wouldn’t even be having this conversation.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#207

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

therealx wrote: post #197
SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a particular portion of this study you're referring to? I don't see anything about risk at vs. beyond your table here.

The CDC just said yesterday that they confirm airborne transmission, and from the case of the choir whom was 6 feet apart, it sure makes it seem beyond one table worth.

The question isn't whether it's possible at all. It is, I don't dispute that, but even post-vaccine we'll never reach a point where it's impossible to transmit the virus. The question is how high the risk is relative to other things.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#208

Post by aogaili »

Things in the US seems absurd from an outsider perspective due to ideological beliefs.

On the same month, you can read two articles coming from the US:

1) Jeff Bezos Becomes The First Person Ever Worth $200 Billion 2) Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

It doesn't take much thinking to conclude that there is something messed up with resource/capital allocation in this economy. But there are fanatic capitalist in the US with a blind/irrational faith in the "invisible hand" that is as dogmatic as praying for Zeus in greek mythology.

Even worst, they can't even get their population to wear masks like many other countries to at least slow down the transmission, mainly due to another set of extreme dogmas and tribalism.

It seems that superpowers can't help but get decayed from inside. With time and enough arrogance, world power societies tend sink in their own delusion when the rest of world pragmatically catch up and pass them by.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#209

Post by just-juan-post »

ehnto wrote: post #200
just-juan-post wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This isn’t about people making decisions for themselves Making decisions for ones self is exactly the principal that the USA was founded on. > You might be fine, but if you are asymptomatic, you can directly harm or kill others and not even know it. See also: Drinking, condom-less sex, smoking, and junk food. All of these things directly or indirectly harm others and if this is about public safety then it's time yo…

The point of a lockdown is to stop people who think like you from hurting others. If we could trust people to act responsibly we wouldn't need to lockdown so strictly, but in example after example someone who thinks like you will ruin it for everyone. Regardless, the US has largely already decided to be on your side and let you make your own decision about how to act during a pandemic, and the results speak for thems…

> The point of a lockdown is to stop people who think like you from hurting others.

So is the point of banning alcohol, unprotected sex, smoking, and junk food.

Drunk people can fight me and kill me while drunk driving.

Unprotected sex may be more pleasurable but if we want to stop hurting others then condoms must be mandatory.

Smoking is an easy one, I can smell that from like 30 feet away. It's clearly getting into my lungs. Ban it completely.

It's been repeatedly shown that obesity is a social disease. What foods would be banned in your area of the country?

I'm having a good Sunday, enjoy this with me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXWhbUUE4ko

Note that I'm a leftie and I love the video so I hope you and others can get over them poking fun at Elizabeth

This is about choice. Stop the restrictions and let the people choose.

Re: Almost 90 percent of NYC bars and restaurants couldn’t pay August rent

#210

Post by sooheon »

MiroF wrote: post #122
threentaway wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need to be pragmatic and get our people and economy through this crisis OK, tax the rich. PS: It was the winning strategy before the crisis too.

What income do you consider the rich? I thought we were all in agreement, but I recently saw some Pew research that had me surprised.

Don't tax the high income bracket, tax the rentier bracket.
Post reply on HN