I no longer build software • Hacker News Board

Re: I no longer build software

#241

Post by criddell » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

goatinaboat wrote: post #130

jb1991 wrote: post #20

Amen. Modern software development is frankly kinda sucky. The old days pre-2000 were arguably a lot more enjoyable. Today it's just digital plumbing and dealing with all sorts of issues that are not creative. The sheer complexity is frankly absurd as well. I've thought about moving on from software many times, and I know many who have. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it's best way to spend your short l…

The old days pre-2000 were arguably a lot more enjoyable. Yes. 1 monitor running the editor full screen, no constant interruptions from IM, documentation in books that actually was accurate, programming the actual machine not piecing together other people’s crapware libraries.

> piecing together other people’s crapware libraries

This is my biggest concern about the state of my profession. It might not be the right analogy, but it gives me a house-of-cards type vibe.

Re: I no longer build software

#242

Post by axegon_ » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

eeZah7Ux wrote: post #164

axegon_ wrote: post #95

Strangely enough, to a degree I envy this guy. I've been at my current job for over 8 years and up until a few months ago I was pretty happy. However politics caught up and I decided to leave. At the moment I have a few offers on the table, one of which is from a company somewhere in the FAANG realm. Senior software engineer, awesome conditions, very generous paycheck, lots of benefits. So tempted by all this I said…

> pulling comments and likes on things which can be considered "inappropriate" and "offensive" > That alone is enough for me to turn down the offer > I take chopping off my finger in a heartbeat You would rather lose a finger that work in a company that has strict very rules around offensive behavior? ...

> You would rather lose a finger that work in a company that has strict very rules around offensive behavior?

As I said, in a heartbeat. I was born behind the iron curtain and still live in a place where it casts a dark shadow. There's a fine line between "strict rules" and full on dictatorship. Frankly I never understood the fuss around the so-called "offensive behavior". I spent 5 years of my life studying abroad. As an eastern European, if I had a cent for every time someone called me a car thief ALONE, I would have made enough money to buy the entire VW group(and never have to steal a car again ho-ho-ho). Do(/did) I care? No.

I have a relative who was fired from their job in the 80's because he said a joke about the dictator at the time and wasn't hired up until the entire regime collapsed almost a decade later. Do you not see the problem with this? It's a question of self-respect and dignity. I don't care what anyone at work does or says, so long as work is being done. Their personal lives are none of my concern. A several-hundred page report which contains likes of a tweets like "A priest, a rapist and a pedophile walk into a bar… He orders a drink." with an "inappropriate" flag is a gross violation if you ask me.

Re: I no longer build software

#243

Post by buttholesurfer » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

I miss the self hosted monolith.

It was so simple to maintain, deploy and share. Then someone wanted a service... then we added a microservice, then we added another, then we addeded docker, then we added 10 more services, then the build was so complex we hired a devops guy... then the builds were too complex, so we started dedicated devops team...

Then we moved to the cloud...

Gah we've done this to ourselves.

Re: I no longer build software

#244

Post by DarkWiiPlayer » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

katsume3 wrote: post #114

I find myself writing less code these days, not because I'm lazy, but because I can borrow so much already-written code from people now, thanks to things like Github and the Internet in general. I am a firm DRY[0] enthusiast, and also, a /Don't Repeat Other's Efforts/[1] enthusiast and it pains me to solve an already-solved problem. Sadly there are people out there calling me a 'Stack Overflow developer' in that I co…

DRY is a good principle when you're aiming for effective product development, but that doesn't mean it's the most fun. I often find myself reinventing the wheel in my private projects, not because I couldn't easily find a library that already does what I want, but because I enjoy that sort of "DIY-Programming". I want to think about all the messy details because it's one of the things that makes programming fun for me.

Maybe this depends a lot on the individual. Some might find my way of enjoying code very boring, as I'm just messing with low-level stuff and not getting that much done. To me it would feel very exhausting to be writing glue-code all the time without messing with the internals of the systems I'm working with and recreating them myself every once in a while.

As a general advise to new developers: Find out what you enjoy about coding and always keep that in mind, be it while looking for a job or starting a new private project.

Re: I no longer build software

#245

Post by notacoward » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:23 PM UTC

chpmrc wrote: post #208

DarkWiiPlayer wrote: post #168

It seems like nowadays you just can't make money building interesting things anymore. Most of the available programming work is really just writing glue code to make big software systems work as intended, to the point where it can feel more like writing configuration files than actual programming. Put simply, 98% of programming these days is scripting. On the other hand, you have lots of fun things one can do with co…

I can order a comfy car anywhere I am with the tap of a button. I can order food from hundreds of restaurants and have it delivered in less than 30 mins with the tap of a button. I can book flights and hotels with the tap of a button. I can play with friends in virtual reality and actually sweat. I can watch a live stream of SpaceX launching reusable rockets in space. I could buy a car that is almost fully "self driv…

Aren't most of the examples you list kind of orthogonal to the issue at hand? They seem more related to living in a world where software exists than to actually being the one who builds it.

Re: I no longer build software

#246

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:24 PM UTC

carlivar wrote: post #158

throwaway8941 wrote: post #145

This is a privileged position to take. IT is one of the very few ways to have a relatively decent life in my third world (well, technically second world) country, especially for those of us who can't rely on nepotism to put them in a comfortable place. Sure, I can go make furniture out of wood for $150 a month (and I did at some point in my life), but I'd rather keep my cushy lifestyle and stare at a screen for 16 ho…

I wonder if those making furniture are just doing it to stave off boredom after cashing in millions of tech stock profits. I've already seen exactly this sort of pattern in a few people I know.

There's definitely some truth to that. I've grown to hate technology over the past decade or so, largely because I'm a technologist who believes that technology should exist to make our lives better and the entire modern industry seems hell bent on doing the opposite. Consequently, I'm considering radical lifestyle changes that I am forced to admit would probably not be possible if I had not saved a good amount of money that I earned working in technology. And I don't even make that much because money was never a big motivator for me.

Re: I no longer build software

#247

Post by mauvehaus » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:24 PM UTC

SamBam wrote: post #199

mauvehaus wrote: post #123

Holy shit, this is me! A couple things to clarify: I posted the original issue as a minor complaint about the docker cli and promptly forgot about it. I never expected it to get any traction or follow-up. At the time I posted it, I was working as a contractor for my former full time employer. I had left full-time work there in early 2017 to attend the full-time program at the (sadly now-defunct) Furniture Institute o…

Your Cabinet on Stand [1] is gorgeous. 1. https://www.flickr.com/photos/fuller_craft/49837847346/in/al...

Thank you!

Re: I no longer build software

#248

Post by kls » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:24 PM UTC

bluebit wrote: post #28

jb1991 wrote: post #20

Amen. Modern software development is frankly kinda sucky. The old days pre-2000 were arguably a lot more enjoyable. Today it's just digital plumbing and dealing with all sorts of issues that are not creative. The sheer complexity is frankly absurd as well. I've thought about moving on from software many times, and I know many who have. Just because you can do something doesn't mean it's best way to spend your short l…

Honest question, what is a great career pivot for someone that's been in development all their life? It seems that nothing pays as well as building software, unless you go into management which most developers would enjoy even less than digital plumbing.

I have a cousin who is a travel welder, he is young and single. He is making over 100k but he has to relocate for work about every 6 months. It's a great gig for a young man, but ones lifestyle would have to fit how the work comes to them.

Re: I no longer build software

#249

Post by FpUser » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:25 PM UTC

I build my own products and I get hired to create products for others. All in various different areas: desktop, web, firmware etc. So no I do not want to stop it. Sure I get board every once in a while when all design is done and now it is time to just write a lot of code (sometime budget allows me to subcontract) but overall I am happy and not planning switching to woodworking any time soon even though I am an old fart. I do lots of physical activity though to keep in good shape and this I think helps with programming part as well.

Re: I no longer build software

#250

Post by mauvehaus » Mon, Sep 21, 2020, 1:25 PM UTC

mauvehaus wrote: post #123

Holy shit, this is me! A couple things to clarify: I posted the original issue as a minor complaint about the docker cli and promptly forgot about it. I never expected it to get any traction or follow-up. At the time I posted it, I was working as a contractor for my former full time employer. I had left full-time work there in early 2017 to attend the full-time program at the (sadly now-defunct) Furniture Institute o…

Replying to say that I'm heading to the shop. If anybody has questions, I'll check back in in the evening (US Eastern) and do my best to answer them then.