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The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

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Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#631

Post by chasd00 »

tidepod12 wrote: post #345
mywittyname wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have noticed that most millenials seem to have completely forgotten the concept of "starter home" and assume that as soon as you turn 25 you should be entitled to a 4 bedroom house with a pool, huge yard, wonderful neighborhood, three-car garage, etc. "Starter homes" for young people is the stuff that was built 30-40 years ago that hasn't been updated. So they are buying those mcmansions because that's what was b…

>"Starter homes" for young people is the stuff that was built 30-40 years ago that hasn't been updated. So they are buying those mcmansions because that's what was built in the 80s-90s-00s. The really nice, older urban areas with housing built before that is way more expensive in absolute dollars. In my metro (DFW), the neighborhoods of houses built in the 60s/70s/80s are dwindling because nobody will buy them. There…

I live in DFW as well (Oak Cliff), one thing to keep in mind about home prices are schools. In East Dallas, on the border of Lakewood schools, there's literally a $100k difference between one side of the street and the other. A good public school in DISD is rare and so home prices around it are very high.

I think the quality of the local school drive home prices considerably.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#632

Post by tuna-piano »

kelnos wrote: post #553
munificent wrote: post #464

I really love the quote at the end: > I'm a dad who is happy to have his daughter and fiancé living with me. They pay the utilities and make me nice meals, and it makes it a lot less lonely here. ... I like the multi-generational thing. I know it won't last forever, but it makes life better for now. It's so easy to get into that cold statistical mindset about these large-scale trends, but it's good to remember that t…

It's also useful to note that the "nuclear family" is a very Western thing, and the US takes it to an extreme. In other parts of the world it's abnormal for adults in their 20s to be living anywhere but with their parents, often even with a fiance or new spouse in the mix. The idea that having a multi-generational household means that the younger members haven't "grown up" and need to "learn to live on their own" is…

While it's true this seems like a strong US thing, I haven't heard many happy long-term stories of folks living intergenerationally.

In my experience (talking to people from a variety of countries), most couples in their 20s/30s want their own place (even in the countries where it's not common). It seems it can even lead to happier intergenerational relationships when the roomate-type fights don't need to happen.

It would seem to me that it's most common in the US to move out because they can afford to... The US is just an incredibly rich place, even compared to much of western Europe (ex. the US has 40% more GDP per capita than France[1])

There are of course also family/social pressures in some places, but I really don't think it's the primary factor in the differences between many countries.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)...

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#633

Post by Nasrudith »

dcolkitt wrote: post #381
mywittyname wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But in places like Tampa, Omaha, Cincinnati, and Phoenix the cost of housing (per square foot) has barely gone up at all. Maybe if you stop looking at like 2018. But my on-the-ground analysis living on one of these cities is cost of housing has fucking exploooded. I built a house just two years ago, which I thought was incredibly expensive at 2 times the median home price in the area. I had it in the back of my hea…

I agree with you in principle. Since the 2008 crisis, previously developer-friendly mid-sized Sunbelt metros have adopted some NIMBY building restriction policies that would make even coastal California blush. But so far, that hasn't really created a housing affordability crisis... yet. A lot of the impact has been mitigated by falling mortgage rates and rising wages. Let's just take Tampa, as one of the hotter housi…

Really cost of housing alone doesn't tell the full story without considering the jobs/income sources in the area.

I have noticed an irony that if housing in an area is really cheap you probably won't be able to afford to live there unless you are already a retiree who doesn't care about long emergency response time - because the highest paying job in the area is say a resturant manager at the local diner.

Before the pandemic economic growth was very urban concentrated - remote working normalizing might reverse the trend but there are still some service and infastructure demand constraints - chances are they need reliable high speed internet.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#634

Post by aphextron »

kelnos wrote: post #553
munificent wrote: post #464

I really love the quote at the end: > I'm a dad who is happy to have his daughter and fiancé living with me. They pay the utilities and make me nice meals, and it makes it a lot less lonely here. ... I like the multi-generational thing. I know it won't last forever, but it makes life better for now. It's so easy to get into that cold statistical mindset about these large-scale trends, but it's good to remember that t…

It's also useful to note that the "nuclear family" is a very Western thing, and the US takes it to an extreme. In other parts of the world it's abnormal for adults in their 20s to be living anywhere but with their parents, often even with a fiance or new spouse in the mix. The idea that having a multi-generational household means that the younger members haven't "grown up" and need to "learn to live on their own" is…

>The idea that having a multi-generational household means that the younger members haven't "grown up" and need to "learn to live on their own" is a completely manufactured attitude. I think many American families would have much stronger, more healthy inter-generational relationships if we lived together (at least for a bit) as adults. As it is now, most US kids leave home just when they're starting to be able to meaningfully contribute to the household as equals.

There's more to it than just learning to live on your own. In the US, we value individuality above all else. People who never move out and forge their own path in life are far less likely to find out who they really are and what they really want out of life. Whether you're aware of it or not, staying so closely attached to your family can massively stunt personal growth. You are constantly reminded of who and what you are "expected" to be, rather than defining that for yourself. You can see this very clearly by going back to your hometown and talking to the people who never left. Sure there's value in the stability and comfort of that life, but you lose out on the opportunity to truly express yourself and be who you want to be.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#635

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

dylanh wrote: post #620
dcolkitt wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Right, but what matters is the housing price where people are. We're not talking about houses in the middle of nowhere. These are major urban population centers. The Houston metro area has 7 million people. The Phoenix metro area has 4.9 million people. Tampa metro has 3.1 million people. Houston and Phoenix are both larger than the Bay Area metro is currently. Tampa's just shy of the size of Seattle. Nor is it the…

Pretty much everyone I know is being priced out of market in the tampa bay area. Rent under $1k/mo means looking on the extreme periphery and suffering a long commute.

> Pretty much everyone I know is being priced out of market in the Tampa bay area.

Rents in the neighboring counties have been climbing steeply for years. If you were looking at an $850/mo property in 2012, expect to pay about $1500/mo for the same place now.

source: 30 year Tampa area resident

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#636

Post by School-Cotton »

colinmhayes wrote: post #235
School-Cotton wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to nitpick but the social isolation and massive unemployment are being caused by our response to the pandemic, not by the pandemic itself. Lockdowns are a choice, with tradeoffs.

Isolation, sure. But unemployment is unavoidable when hundreds of thousands of people die.

How so? Almost 3 million people die every year in the US.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#637

Post by user5994461 »

collyw wrote: post #13
save_ferris wrote: post #8

I moved back into my parents house after my lease expired, primarily to have regular social interaction again. > "While moving back home during the pandemic makes sense and is seen as socially acceptable or even smart, it also means you are living with people who still see you as your 18-year-old self." One of the biggest things I’ve noticed among millennials is how many parents fail to understand the emotional and m…

I will probably be going against the grain here, but I managed to rent a flat by myself while in university years ago with a part time job in a supermarket at weekends and applying for some hardship funds and other money available at the time. Rents have risen a lot since then, but is it really impossible for someone in work to be able to afford rent? Or are they insisting on living in a fashionable part of town? (Fo…

>>> but is it really impossible for someone in work to be able to afford rent?

Yes. I've seen what my younger sisters and exes earned working in London in jobs like waitress or saleswoman or law.

The salary simply doesn't cover rent and bills for a one bedroom. It doesn't matter how you put it, it just doesn't work.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#638

Post by Xylakant »

ketzu wrote: post #595
dcolkitt wrote: post #246

> Housing is more expensive for them than prior generations I harp on this constantly. But housing is not more expensive in the majority of American metros. Adjusted for inflation the median cost per square foot of new housing is almost exactly the same as it was in 1990. (This doesn't even take into account that mortgage rates are drastically lower since then.) We get skewed on this for two reasons. One is because h…

> (This doesn't even take into account that mortgage rates are drastically lower since then.) Which is an important factor, too! In Germany rates seem to be around 1%, as low as 0.5% fixed for 10 years. (US seems higher though)

Keep in mind that this is the advertised best rate, often not including fees etc. It’s unlike that you’ll actually end up paying that rate.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#639

Post by ianmobbs »

MattGaiser wrote: post #576
babelfish wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Two is that we're highly skewed to a handful of elite metros, whose housing markets are not representative of the country as a whole Right, but what matters is the housing price where people are. It doesn't matter what the housing market looks like in South Dakota if I don't want to live there. While houses in South Dakota may be 1/10 the price of houses in NYC (likely cheaper, honestly), they also have 1/10 the po…

> if I don't want to live there. But then you are choosing to be poorer. And that can be a valid choice, but it is a choice you are making.

That's ridiculous. The expectation of affordable housing, and being unable to move to some random town in South Dakota, comes down to the personal responsibility of "choosing to be poorer"?

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#640

Post by chasd00 »

larrik wrote: post #343
tidepod12 wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>One is because homes today are substantially larger and have more amenities than they did in previous generations. I have noticed that most of my fellow millennials seem to have completely forgotten the concept of "starter home" and assume that as soon as you turn 25 you should be entitled to a 4 bedroom house with a pool, huge yard, wonderful neighborhood, three-car garage, etc. Among my friends that have bought ho…

I did the "starter home" thing in 2006 and then the market crashed and I was under water until 2019... I would never recommend the idea of a "starter home" to anyone, ever. It only works when housing prices are on the rise and continue that way the entire time you live there.

is there such a thing as non-survivor bias? You perfectly timed the most dramatic fall in home prices in maybe a 100 years. The subprime collapse aside, a home purchase is usually a safe investment.
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