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Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

wsj.com

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Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#11

Post by kevingadd »

anm89 wrote: post #8
jrockway wrote: post #3

Apple writes in their court filing: “Epic sought to enjoy all of the benefits of Apple’s iOS platform and related services while its ‘hotfix’ lined Epic’s pockets at Apple’s expense.” It seems that Apple has forgotten that each iPhone user already paid Apple hundreds (if not thousands) of dollars for the iPhone itself. It is reasonable to charge developers for development tools, but if that's what you want to do, jus…

While in principle I agree with you, if Epic signed an agreement that they owed Apple a percent based on initial terms, then that is out the window.

Their whole argument is that the agreement shouldn't be enforceable, which is why they sued first. Naturally, that means they signed the agreement.

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#12

Post by gpm »

digismack wrote: post #10
arijun wrote: post #2

Can we please stop using paywalled sources? Here's one that's not paywalled for me, if someone else has an issue with it I will try to find another decent source that's not paywalled. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/09/08/epic-ap... Alternatively, https://www.cnbc.com/2020/09/08/apple-seeks-damages-from-epi...

WaPo is paywalled as well.

It is? That link isn't paywalled for me either.

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#13

Post by kwanbix »

anm89 wrote: post #8
jrockway wrote: post #3

Apple writes in their court filing: “Epic sought to enjoy all of the benefits of Apple’s iOS platform and related services while its ‘hotfix’ lined Epic’s pockets at Apple’s expense.” It seems that Apple has forgotten that each iPhone user already paid Apple hundreds (if not thousands) of dollars for the iPhone itself. It is reasonable to charge developers for development tools, but if that's what you want to do, jus…

While in principle I agree with you, if Epic signed an agreement that they owed Apple a percent based on initial terms, then that is out the window.

That something is written on a contract does not means that is enforceable. If not I will create a contract that says you are now the president and you will still not be.

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#14

Post by [deleted] »

arijun wrote: post #2

Can we please stop using paywalled sources? Here's one that's not paywalled for me, if someone else has an issue with it I will try to find another decent source that's not paywalled. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/09/08/epic-ap... Alternatively, https://www.cnbc.com/2020/09/08/apple-seeks-damages-from-epi...

[deleted]

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#15

Post by adsjhdashkj »

anm89 wrote: post #4

It's as if Apple is on a mission to destroy the credibility and respect they had.

I felt like every poor quality controlled release they've had on OSX for the last 10 years has been trying to do that.

I feel lost. Wanting to have a simple OS that lets me develop with unix tools but also "just works". The expense i pay for Apple products no longer follows this, for me.

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#17

Post by rriepe »

adsjhdashkj wrote: post #15
anm89 wrote: post #4

It's as if Apple is on a mission to destroy the credibility and respect they had.

I felt like every poor quality controlled release they've had on OSX for the last 10 years has been trying to do that. I feel lost. Wanting to have a simple OS that lets me develop with unix tools but also "just works". The expense i pay for Apple products no longer follows this, for me.

Solus has been this for me

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#18

Post by toomuchtodo »

kevingadd wrote: post #11
anm89 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While in principle I agree with you, if Epic signed an agreement that they owed Apple a percent based on initial terms, then that is out the window.

Their whole argument is that the agreement shouldn't be enforceable, which is why they sued first. Naturally, that means they signed the agreement.

Sounds like, at least temporarily, the court believes the agreement to be enforceable.

>In a ruling late last month, Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers largely rejected similar arguments Epic made in seeking a restraining order against Apple regarding Fortnite development on iOS. There was no "irreparable harm" to Epic, Rogers wrote, because "the current predicament appears of [Epic's] own making."

> "Your client created this situation," Rogers told lawyers for Epic in an August hearing. "Your client does not come to this action with clean hands... in my view, you cannot have irreparable harm when you create the harm yourself."

> "The court recommended that Epic comply with the App Store guidelines while their case moves forward, guidelines they’ve followed for the past decade until they created this situation," Apple said in a statement earlier this month." Epic has refused. Instead they "repeatedly submit Fortnite updates designed to violate the guidelines of the App Store."

EDIT: @gpm The status quo you refer to is Epic abiding by the agreement they argue is unenforceable. I have to be mindful about my reply quantity, HN throttles me otherwise, hence the edit.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/08/judge-issues-restrain...

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#19

Post by untog »

jrockway wrote: post #3

Apple writes in their court filing: “Epic sought to enjoy all of the benefits of Apple’s iOS platform and related services while its ‘hotfix’ lined Epic’s pockets at Apple’s expense.” It seems that Apple has forgotten that each iPhone user already paid Apple hundreds (if not thousands) of dollars for the iPhone itself. It is reasonable to charge developers for development tools, but if that's what you want to do, jus…

"at Apple's expense" really surprised me in that statement, too. Certainly, Epic's move denied Apple money they would have earned, but "at their expense" makes it sound like Epic was going to bankrupt them.

Re: Apple countersues Epic, seeks punitive damages

#20

Post by jayd16 »

digismack wrote: post #10
arijun wrote: post #2

Can we please stop using paywalled sources? Here's one that's not paywalled for me, if someone else has an issue with it I will try to find another decent source that's not paywalled. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/09/08/epic-ap... Alternatively, https://www.cnbc.com/2020/09/08/apple-seeks-damages-from-epi...

WaPo is paywalled as well.

You can read wapo in incognito mode but not the wsj.
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