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Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

tech.newstatesman.com

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Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#101

Post by ArkVark »

AgloeDreams wrote: post #58
ArkVark wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extreme wealth is not valued in Europe. To the contrary, income (even upper-middle class income) and consumption is incredibly highly taxed. Many small and mid-sized business struggle or refuse to scale because it exposes them, their owners and management to taxes which cannot be escaped (by contrast small businesses can pay their staff in cash, and charge personal expenses to business accounts for VAT writeoffs). Al…

That article is incredibly insane and use of it clearly invalidates any other statement you made here. It even goes as far to basically blame the poor for their own poverty. It makes zero consideration for the higher health care costs or general cost of living differences between America and Europe (for example: The average European does not need to own a car, does not need expensive heating or extreme cooling, and t…

The poor outcomes for healthcare in the USA can be mostly attributed to obesity and the poorer diets and habits of the population.

The USA's privatised healthcare system would operate a lot more efficiently if sugar was heavily taxed, fresh fruit and vegetables consistently available (no 'food deserts'), and coal and oil burning for transport and energy minimised.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#102

Post by fakedang »

082349872349872 wrote: post #29
ArgyleSound wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A US trade deal is a symbolic and political victory but makes virtually no difference economically. I don’t think the UK government will calculate that prospect of one would outweigh losing ARM.

Chess-wise, it seems a bit of a skewer: lose ARM by sale, or lose ARM by RISC-V? (Is it still true the UK-US trade deal is awaiting elections in the latter? EU-UK has certainly not been progressing.)

To answer your second question, yes.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#103

Post by someperson »

ethbr0 wrote: post #67
someperson wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why can't NVidia achieve this without spending tens of billions buying ARM?

You have a lot of options available when you own a company, that you don't have when they're independent. Example: Nvidia would prefer certain specifications on an internal bus they'd use, but nobody else uses as a standard.

Sounds like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NVLink and NVidia doesn't own AMD, Intel or motherboard manufacturers

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#104

Post by charwalker »

ArgyleSound wrote: post #4
onion2k wrote: post #3

While the article talks about the possibility of the UK government blocking a sale to Nvidia, the situation with Brexit and the need to get trade deals with the US means it's really likely the government here would allow the sale to go ahead should the US government make it a condition of a deal. Brexit has screwed the UK.

A US trade deal is a symbolic and political victory but makes virtually no difference economically. I don’t think the UK government will calculate that prospect of one would outweigh losing ARM.

You're ignoring decades if not centuries of politics and economic data. This is an insane claim so I'd love to see citations.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#105

Post by [deleted] »

banjo_milkman wrote: post #83
ethbr0 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would be curious on any Brits' opinions on if this (failure to support revolutionary technology) happens more there, and if so then why. Recognize biases of hindsight, but it seems like private equity markets in Britain aren't interested in technology at the requisite scale. There's an incredible historical tradition [1], but the majority tend to be either developed with the help of a (1) few angel investors (and the…

There are multiple examples of revolutionary technology from the UK: 1) ARM - dominates embedded systems, >90% of cellphones and IoT, sold to SoftBank, now on the way to NVidia 2) DeepMind - arguably global leader in AI, now part of Google 3) Illumina/Solexa - >90% of global DNA sequencing market, biotech leader, sold to Illumina for $600, Solexa sequencing now the basis for a $50bn market cap Britain has the problem…

[deleted]

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#106

Post by ChrisLomont »

Hokusai wrote: post #91
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100x this! I think it's our fault as Europeans that we don't value and invest in tech enough. Why is it the US's fault that they consider tech to be valuable to their economy and national security and we don't? What's stopping us from doing the same? As long as we'll keep treating tech as some cost center instead of a core business while we keep pumping money to keep afloat 19th century industries who's ships have sa…

> Why is it the US's fault that they consider tech to be valuable to their economy and national security and we don't? USA has created monstrous monopolies that are very heavily subsidized by the government. Amazon, Apple, etc. do not pay taxes and yet get big sums of money to settle in cities. That is the money that USA is using to buy European companies. China blocked the USA from buying their tech, and the result…

On the claim these companies don’t pay US taxes, you should look at their SEC filings.

Here [1], for example, is one for Apple, showing them paying an income tax rate north of 20%, for tens of billions of dollars. Then they pay payroll taxes, property taxes, import taxes, sales taxes, for many more billions.

All the companies you claim aren’t paying taxes are.

[1] https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/320193/0000320193180...

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#107

Post by bennysonething »

Hokusai wrote: post #98
bennysonething wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Erm, I quite like American tech. Google is an unbelievable resource. Provided for free. You want to ban it? I wonder how much business it drives to British companies. Also I couldn't do my job with out it. Amazon taking over all our businesses? That's a bold claim, any stats to back that up. A family member of mine runs a business on Amazon. You'd like to kill her business? There is literally no other platform that d…

> I couldn't do my job with out it. Yes. That is the point. The need exists. European companies will offer that services creating high quality jobs in Europe and they will follow European cultural norms instead of American ones. > There is literally no other platform that does something like fba. That is the monopoly part promoted by the USA and financed with public money. Amazon is a monopoly protected by a friendly…

What are european cultural norms?

Are you really trying to claim Amazon is financed by tax payer money in the USA? Can you provide examples of this investment?

Fba is monopoly because Amazon took a huge bet and invented it. Same with prime.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#108

Post by Hokusai »

Melkman wrote: post #100
bennysonething wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Erm, I quite like American tech. Google is an unbelievable resource. Provided for free. You want to ban it? I wonder how much business it drives to British companies. Also I couldn't do my job with out it. Amazon taking over all our businesses? That's a bold claim, any stats to back that up. A family member of mine runs a business on Amazon. You'd like to kill her business? There is literally no other platform that d…

Google does not provide that service for free. Where do you think the $27 billion Google search revenue comes from ? Also you might want to read https://onezero.medium.com/how-to-destroy-surveillance-capit... The reason Amazon an Google are successful is that they are unopposed monopolists that acquire or destroy any business that might pose a risk to them.

> not provide that service for free

You are right there. We are the product, we give our data, we give our attention, it is not free.

> unopposed monopolists that acquire or destroy any business that might pose a risk to them

Good point. That is also true for other ones like Facebook that purchased Whatsapp just to keep the monopoly in personal communications.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#109

Post by esperent »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #41
esperent wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is "them" in your scenario? The entire British public? They didn't get a say in the matter. It was a small group of politicians and business folk. And as always, they are not the ones crying now because they made bank in the deal, no doubt.

Well, collectively they did vote for the conservatives, who are exactly for this kind of thing.

* Shadow organisations backed by US billionaires pumping hundred of millions of dollars into misinformation campaigns. * The Murdoch news empire which basically does the same thing. * Russia backed misinformation campaigns. * Decades of mismanagement of education.

... and probably lots more that I don't know about since I'm not from the UK. Blaming the misled and uneducated masses for this kind of thing just doesn't work.

Re: Hermann Hauser: ‘It’s in Nvidia’s Interests to Destroy Arm’

#110

Post by Hokusai »

ChrisLomont wrote: post #106
Hokusai wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is it the US's fault that they consider tech to be valuable to their economy and national security and we don't? USA has created monstrous monopolies that are very heavily subsidized by the government. Amazon, Apple, etc. do not pay taxes and yet get big sums of money to settle in cities. That is the money that USA is using to buy European companies. China blocked the USA from buying their tech, and the result…

On the claim these companies don’t pay US taxes, you should look at their SEC filings. Here [1], for example, is one for Apple, showing them paying an income tax rate north of 20%, for tens of billions of dollars. Then they pay payroll taxes, property taxes, import taxes, sales taxes, for many more billions. All the companies you claim aren’t paying taxes are. [1] https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/320193/000032…

That seem impressive numbers until you look at the total numbers that companies they move:

https://fortune.com/2018/01/18/apple-bonuses-money-us-350-bi...

You are taking the statement literally. In that sense you are completely right, that companies pay an amount of taxes above zero. But, if I pay $100 in taxes but I get back $110 then I have effectively not paid taxes. Even that is not literally true as I paid and then I got them back.

> income tax rate north of 20%

That is after all the accounting magic. As a non-tech example, did you knew that Harry Potter movies did not won any money (https://deadline.com/2010/07/studio-shame-even-harry-potter-...). Of course, that is ridiculous, but it is accounting truth.

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