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Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

techcrunch.com

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Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#61

Post by aqme28 »

clement_b wrote: post #34

This is a tsunami for ad tech. Facebook just being the tip of the iceberg here. Tracking or not tracking is not really the topic here. Rather, this is yet another proof of how abusive Apple is. They claim killing IDFA is for the sake of users' privacy, while they do track users and their behavior and feed them sponsored search results on the App Store (via Apple Search Ads). This ability is just too good to share! Ap…

What's the appropriate amount of notice to give?

I think what they're doing here is objectively a Good Thing, and don't really follow your argument otherwise, though I agree that it's bad if Apple simply takes it over.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#62

Post by iguy »

cortesoft wrote: post #35
tmhrtly wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think in some situations if users see value in the opt-in then it can be ok. E.g. your phone asking you if you're happy to share your location with an app. I sure as hell want my mapping app to know where I am, but I also feel very comforted that I still get a say in the process. The thing about this tracking opt-in is that no user would ever want it because it's solely there to exploit them. So in this case I thin…

Wouldn't the value in this situation be "you get to use Facebook"? If they didn't make money off their users, Facebook wouldn't exist. Would you be ok if they did it that way? A warning that says "by using Facebook, you are agreeing to be tracked", at which point the user could either continue or uninstall the app?

Aren't they free to make their app not work at all without this setting? If so, then they must still find enough in letting you use facebook without it, even if less than they would like.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#63

Post by echelon »

cma wrote: post #47
ghj wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair if you add an opt-in step to anything, it will kill that thing. No moral judgement, just human laziness. If it doesn't kill it, it still becomes something everyone loathes (e.g., how you need an extra click to accept cookies on every site you use).

Most people gladly opt in to use their webcam for Zoom.

That's the key feature. That's why they're using the product.

I opt-in to using my car to drive, and I opt-in to using my laptop to write code.

I don't opt-in for tracking, advertising, or other negative externalities.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#64

Post by nottorp »

reaperducer wrote: post #16
mr__y wrote: post #8

Maybe this will encourage switching to context-based ads. If I'm reading blog post about Rust, I might be interested in buying books or online training in Rust. Or, if I'm watching a video on how to take care of kitten, food or vaccination for kitten might be of interest for me. Nobody needs to track all my activity to guess that.

If I'm reading blog post about Rust, I might be interested in buying books or online training in Rust I have been repeatedly assured by ad tech experts on HN that Facebook (and Google's) advertisements which are custom-tailored to my tabulated interests are far superior to the ads I would get through traditional context advertising. You can tell by all the ads I see on Facebook for feminine hygiene products for the l…

Don't forget the ads following you across websites for the expensive product (that you only need one of) you just bought.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#65

Post by op03 »

aowerijwaerj wrote: post #37

Facebook is 21st-century cigarettes. Thousands of brilliant scientists and engineers testing and optimizing their product to be as addictive as possible. No concern for the effects on their users or on society. The only concern is making money. Just like with cigarettes, at first it was cool, then it became mainstream, then the dangers became better known, then the CEO was ordered to appear before Congress and gave a…

Cigarettes aren't free and haven't caused society to implode in every country on the planet.

Dopamine on the other hand, that the Facebook cartel pushes through their Like counting, attention capturing/engagement maximizing algos is Free and Unlimited.

If cigarettes were handed out for free and in unlimited quantities to everyone, for watching cat videos and accumulating Likes by insulting each other 24x7 then sure comparing Facebook to Big Tobacco would be apt.

They are a type of drug cartel that has never existed in history and their execs need to be thrown in jail for being completely clueless for so long.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#66

Post by nottorp »

It just occured to me that we're looking at Facebook wrong.

Why do people come to FB? For the content that other people post. There would be no eyeballs for the ads if the users didn't post content.

Shouldn't Facebook give us a piece of that ad revenue then?

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#67

Post by ie7eyrdueu »

cheeze wrote: post #2

... And nothing of value was lost. If it's detremental to your business to not be able to track users on such a granular level, it's a bad business. I'm sure Facebook will survive here. 100% biased, can't stand that company.

I'm a fanboy for most of the 'evil' companies but I still see all the appstore drama as silly. If people are already willing to pay 30% then they're either making a significant return anyway or the production>distribution overhead is just that much simpler. Either way, they are clearly already getting something worth the price, they would just prefer to be making even more.

Nothing stops people from only publishing Android apps, people chase Apple because of the convenience of the platform and the spending habits of its users. Both of these things are results of Apple's aggressive micromanagement of its platform not things that happened despite of it.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#68

Post by cblconfederate »

celestialcheese wrote: post #49
cblconfederate wrote: post #5

> Now Apple is going to slowly shut off the oxygen in order to take the value for themselves. what happened was that developers left the facebook platform and all those viral games consolidated into zynga . Also , with targeted channels closed, ad money will have to flow to non-targeted ads, which actually benefits small publishers who can sell a lot of impressions. It's not like ad spending will stop

Untargeted ads are worse for small publishers, not better. Avg cpms right now for targeted ads are around $3-3.50. Untargeted, ~$.50 (Safari/Firefox CPMs). What I think we'll see is ad spend will flow more to the walled gardens since targeted ads still will be available, and perform significantly better than untargeted. Source: I own websites that make money with ads.

if there are no targeted ads, cpms have no way to go but up

There is only so much inventory to sell in walled gardens, people don't spend all their time on FB properties. And if apple makes it more difficult for FB to target users, the line between targeted/untargeted gets blurry

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#69

Post by colejohnson66 »

iguy wrote: post #62
cortesoft wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't the value in this situation be "you get to use Facebook"? If they didn't make money off their users, Facebook wouldn't exist. Would you be ok if they did it that way? A warning that says "by using Facebook, you are agreeing to be tracked", at which point the user could either continue or uninstall the app?

Aren't they free to make their app not work at all without this setting? If so, then they must still find enough in letting you use facebook without it, even if less than they would like.

IIRC, Apple’s rules say an app is prohibited from not functioning if it’s denied permission.

Re: Facebook isn’t happy about Apple’s upcoming ad tracking restrictions

#70

Post by mk4 »

nottorp wrote: post #66

It just occured to me that we're looking at Facebook wrong. Why do people come to FB? For the content that other people post. There would be no eyeballs for the ads if the users didn't post content. Shouldn't Facebook give us a piece of that ad revenue then?

That sounds like youtube
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