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China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

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Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#151

To those that believe that they would not have turned a blind eye during WWII to the systematic extermination of Jews, the current generation has been given a similar challenge. Where is your cancel-culture now? How will our children think of us?

I don’t understand what the ‘cancel culture’ comment is supposed to mean. There are a million tweets condemning China’s behavior... way more than the number of tweets targeting people who are ‘cancelled’ The difference is that tweets can effect a regular person’s life, and they are ‘cancelled’. China doesn’t care. A company will act to fire a single person who behaves badly because of consumer pressure; it doesn’t co…

A really good "code smell" for political bullshit is when a person or idea is simultaneously an ineffectual loser and a grave, powerful, insidious force. Closely related to the notion that the leader is simultaneously both a powerful winner and a powerless victim.

"cancel culture" here is both powerful and dangerous enough to bring down Western civilization, yet so laughably weak it cannot even pretend to solve real problems.

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#152
post #124
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I denounced it online several times, that's all I can do. You can do more. Write your representatives. Call their offices (both Democrat and Republican), and buy fewer Chinese products, even it costs more money. Please keep in mind I'm not criticizing you here, just saying you could literally do more if you wanted to. I do get annoyed with people who "complain online'. That's just a waste of time. Call your represe…

> I do get annoyed with people who "complain online'. That's just a waste of time. It's really not. I learned about this situation by reading complaints and passive comments online.

Let me clarify: I believe it's a waste of time if we're also not complaining to our elected representatives.

If 10,000 people read this article and got annoyed, and then we made 10,000 phone calls, things would happen. If 10 people pick up the phone... not so much.

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#153
post #117
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I don't shut up.

Hypothetically, let's say you're a regular Chinese citizen concerned about human rights abuses and police brutality in the US. Can you roughly estimate the impact of your forum posts, boycotts, and all that on US government policy?

It depends on a lot of factors such as who and how many see your posts, how much you consume and how much you boycott etc. If you’re alone the impact is small but if others are starting to follow suit the number goes up fast and the voice becomes stronger.

It is easy to think the impact is nill and that’s exactly how the opressor wants you to think, no wonder the divide and conquer is a strategy that works. But every movement starts off with a few who believe they make a difference and eventually it picks up a critical mass

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#155
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m voting and campaigning for politicians that I might disagree with on 99% of all issues for the sole reason that they’re willing and capable of standing up to China. For reference, my views are aligned with Sanders but I’d vote for Trump solely based on his actions towards China. I’d also say boycotting Made in China and companies kowtowing to China isn’t as difficult as people say. You might not be able to boycot…

==For reference, my views are aligned with Sanders but I’d vote for Trump solely based on his actions towards China.== What is Trump doing about the concentration camps this article is about?

Tacitly approving of them to Xi, according to Bolton.

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#156
post #13

I can't believe this isn't something people are rallying for. Nor can I believe the mainstream media is hardly talking about it. The lessons from WWII aren't stories that we should memorise as fun trivia facts.

It hasn't been widely covered outside of the anti-CCP sources. It seems to be gaining a bit of traction lately. If you are interested, Epoch times, BitterWinter and others have been covering this for a long time. Establishment media partisans aren't shy about using Nazi comparisons. Over the past year you would have been more likely to hear criticisms of US immigration policies painted in this light.

> Epoch times ... I'm amazed by how brainwashed one has to be to regard Epoch times as a reliable outlet worthy of attention.

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#157
post #26
post #13

I can't believe this isn't something people are rallying for. Nor can I believe the mainstream media is hardly talking about it. The lessons from WWII aren't stories that we should memorise as fun trivia facts.

Well... everyone could stop buying stuff on Amazon when you know it's mostly made in China, but then again everyone wants cheap 'stuff' (and iPhones).

And than? The whole system depends on cheap supply of goods. Look what happend during the lookdown in China And it's not people want cheap stuff, most only can afford cheap stuff. Money is a finite source, the more some people have, the less have others.

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cancel culture means boycotting public figures or companies after they have done or said something considered objectionable or offensive. You are talking only about tweets but those have little to do with it. Boycotting China is definitely possible, simply stop buying their goods. Vote with your wallet! If enough people do this then it will definitely have an impact, possibly even enough to bring about some real chan…

> Boycotting China is definitely possible, simply stop buying their goods. Is it possible though? I’m really not so sure.

A 100% boycott of China is difficult, especially if you were to try to boycott things that were made elsewhere but have a lot of Chinese stuff in their supply chain. But even just boycotting what you can is a positive step.

You can also support political action that takes concrete steps against China for these atrocities, rather than supporting them. There are real differences in political stances here.

You don't need to feel utterly powerless because you can't solve the problem 100%. That's always true anyhow, but especially true of something of this magnitude. It's OK; literally nobody expects that. You can take what steps you can. You are being joined by many other people.

I often think about it that way; if I'm moved enough to action because of this particular belief, then the odds are pretty good that many other people are as well. It is the actions of that group that will matter. If that group all individually concludes that their individual actions are meaningless, then the whole group will do nothing. So I choose not to act on the belief that my individual actions are meaningless.

(Essentially an argument based on superrationality: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superrationality It is obviously false that the rest of the world is entirely superrational... but it is also false that they are 0% superrational. Often too much time is spent on the irrationality of human beings... a lot of people seem to have a model of them in which they are insane crazies who never make a sane decision, but if you take that model seriously everyone covered by it would just die. Humans are often quite rational. They just really, deeply suck at explaining why they are doing what they are doing, but the actual actions are often quite rational when understood in the correct context.)

Re: China Built a Vast New Infrastructure to Imprison Uighurs

#160
When I was traveling around Xinjiang about two years back it was obvious something was going on.

In Korla everyone getting off the train had to submit to a retinal scan, presumably so authorities know all the ingress and egress into town, going to a park involved going through a checkpoint. To get into any train station at all involved 3 levels of checkpoints, the first checkpoint started before you got to the plaza before the train station, so checking in took about 3 hours. In Kashgar the old city had checkpoints at every corner. The entire province only had 3G, the moment you cross over from neighboring Gansu your China Telecom signal dropped from 4G, so sending videos or even pictures is very difficult even on weChat, if you try to do it through a VPN the experience is even slower.

Some checkpoints were vigilant, but in my experience most were just bored. One checkpoint basically forgot to check my ID because I was seated all the at the back of a van. Young Uighur men or woman sometimes with a Han standing around or sitting at a chair with a desk in the middle of the street, writing down the names of everyone who crosses his "stand".

What surprised me the most was that most of the guards manning the checkpoints in towns, highways, at gas stations (which involved a full car search in order to pull into) were Uighurs themselves. I get the impression you basically went to jail or joined the security apparatus, a modern variation on a old Chinese strategem of using barbarian to fight barbarian I guess.

The whole experience changed my perspective on human beings in general. At the end of the day, when I got back home the only conclusion I could come to wasn't even about China or Chinese, if we look at the long span of human history the only thing I can arrive at is human beings in aggregate have a high tendency to do shitty things. Goodness exists in individuals but as soon as we have to appeal to the common denominator of a group or groups more often then not being a piece of shit is the easiest and most expedient.

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