Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

321–330 of 688 posts

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#321

Post by username90 »

asdasfasdfasdf wrote: post #278
macinjosh wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but rather they have limited choices available to them given their resources and background. So let's take one more choice away!? Not every person looking to make some money is looking for something with as much commitment as employment. Not every business needs people to work according to their schedule at a specific place. While you think you're giving full-time employment and benefits to all of these people what…

>While you think you're giving full-time employment and benefits to all of these people what you're really doing is taking certain kinds of opportunities away. This is some of the most phenomenal bullshit I've ever read. There's nothing stopping Uber and Lyft from allowing people to work their own hours and also giving them benefits if they meet hourly qualifications. You're talking about people making <$30k a year w…

> There's nothing stopping Uber and Lyft from allowing people to work their own hours and also giving them benefits if they meet hourly qualifications.

There is, if the driver drives in bad hours making their income not come up to minimum wage uber would be forced to pay the driver anyway. In order to avoid this uber would be forced to limit when and where people can drive.

Being an employee means that the company has to ensure that the employees time is well spent so that it is worth the minimum wage and benefits at least. Being a contractor means that the contractor himself is responsible for what he is doing is profitable enough for him to live on. So changing them to employees means that now uber has to ensure every driver only drives when it is profitable for uber.

So everyone who wants to handle this responsibility themselves don't want to be an employee.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#322

Post by dcftoapv »

mdorazio wrote: post #289
dcftoapv wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Los Angeles taxi union prevented (read: bribed and coerced) the state / city government from installing a train from LAX to DTLA because they were rolling in cash. Then, they got pissed about Uber, and had a rule enacted that forced passengers to take a bus to an external lot which turned the world's worst airport congestion into a way worse situation. It is not unrealistic to think that they are a driving force…

Was there ever a legitimately priced proposal for a train to go from LAX to DTLA? The only reason the Expo line worked was because the rights of way, and in some cases the rail itself, was already in place. I don't remember seeing anything other than concepts for an LAX train (not the people mover under construction now, an actual train) and thinking they would never get the funding and permits to make it work. To yo…

Also a frequent flier. It sucked before but the solution was 100% designed to benefit cab drivers. Moreover, it absolutely fucked up the entrance to the airport which went from long, but doable, to dozens of people missing their flights per-day bad.

I live in Playa Vista and had a 1.5 hour trip to LAX in November. I was this close to driving through there at 3am and stealing every one of their traffic cones.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#323

Post by gamblor956 »

ng12 wrote: post #282
JMTQp8lwXL wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They want to stay independent, fine. Then actually treat them like independent contractors. Let them set rates. Let them decline rides without facing penalties by the platform. Make the changes necessary to fit the independent contractor model. And not just the rideshare company, but the state too: these workers need unemployment insurance, as Covid has shown, and somebody needs to pay for it: be it the workers or th…

> Let them decline rides without facing penalties by the platform The independent contractor model works both ways. Uber has the right to avoid working with contractors who continually refuse work. You can't be picky about your work but also demand the company keep contracting you like you weren't. The independent contractor model doesn't map perfectly to gig work but it's much closer than traditional employees.

The point of Uber's alleged model is that Uber is not employing the driver, but rather that it is simply matching up drivers to passengers as a marketplace.

If that's the case, then Uber has no right to avoid working with contractors simply because they continually refuse work. That indicates a non-independent agency arrangement between Uber and the driver (aka "employee") and that's what they're claiming they don't have.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#325

Post by afrojack123 »

Possibly a dumb and general question. Is Uber and Lyft responsible for state tax revenue from its contractors? Or are the contractors supposed to pay their own taxes? I could understand the states having problems with contractor's paying their own taxes considering their incomes are lower.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#326

Post by granzymes »

gruez wrote: post #316
hammock wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I was curious about what drivers think. I guess they're not happy [1] but want to be independent contractors still [2]. If the employers don't want the change... and the employees don't want the change... and the customers don't want the change... and the shareholders don't want the change... and the residents of California don't want the change (exhibited by the threads yesterday with outcry over the decision to sh…

>and the residents of California don't want the change (exhibited by the threads yesterday with outcry over the decision to shut down)... but didn't they also vote in favor of AB5? I'd take a referendum result over a non-uniform sampling of people's opinions. edit: nevermind. AB5 wasn't a referendum, so citizens actually didn't get to vote on it.

No, the referendum is this November (prop 22).

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#327

Post by kooshball »

wskinner wrote: post #10
ffggvv wrote: post #8

I’m not sure why we need prop22 specifically targeting rideshare drivers instead of just repealing AB5 i know so many people’s whose jobs were destroyed by it and still haven’t found anything else.

Can you share the professions of the people you know whose jobs were destroyed?

one example https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-12-17/vox-media-...

The only reason we haven't seen other professions being widely decimated by AB5 is because they all lobbied for exemptions which again shows how corrupt this law was.

See the full list here https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/exempt-job-categorie...

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#328

Post by senderista »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #210
serjester wrote: post #99

Completely anecdotal but I bring this question up every time I drive in an Uber and overwhelmingly the drivers tell me they want to stay independent. No one is forcing drivers into their jobs. I really struggle to understand why we need bureaucrats imposing their idea of what a market should look like on an fairly efficient market. From my experience the drivers are perfectly aware of the costs that go into driving s…

I feel like there is a general pattern. The left tends to prioritize all the good ideas: gender equality, racial equality, income gaps, etc. The right tends to prioritize systems that actually function in the real world with real people who are sometimes jealous, stupid, unethical, liars, etc. This is just a case where the first group has run amok without talking to the second group. It's the good idea of everyone sh…

There's a difference between being skeptical of idealistic schemes and fetishizing the status quo, which is what I think the right predominantly does.

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#329

Post by aeyes »

ccktlmazeltov wrote: post #71

This is all a shit show because the infrastructures in place are currently doomed for the market to succeed: - no healthcare means you're a slave of whatever you can find, - tipping culture means your employer can pay you shit

I once worked for a company which was already established in many markets, no tips allowed and fair pay. When the company entered the US market we got asked about tipping left and right. Workers seem to like the gamble on getting a huge tip and for certain industries customers just assume that workers aren't well paid.

But do you tip at Mc'Donalds, the gas station or the supermarket?

Re: Uber and Lyft shutdown in California averted as judge grants emergency stay

#330

Post by TheAceOfHearts »

monadic2 wrote: post #303
dcftoapv wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

@tom No, it's not being built. The train that is currently under construction will connect the airport terminals to a cab stand and car rental station less than a mile from the airport because LA taxi drivers threw a shit fit when they suggested building a train into downtown and Santa Monica. By the way, we're paying $4 billion for that. $4 billion to carry passengers less than a mile from the airport so they can th…

Blame the corrupt officials that enabled this, you can hardly blame a union for trying to act in their own self interest. They don't represent you but the city does.

It's possible to blame both. You can certainly blame the union for acting against the common good.
Post reply on HN