Why did the A-level algorithm say no? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why did the A-level algorithm say no?

#141

Post by NLips » Mon, Aug 17, 2020, 9:01 PM UTC

chongli wrote: post #6

Jabbles wrote: post #3

Do teachers recommend a grade, or a score? If they only recommend grades, how did the algorithm pick which students to change the grades for?

The algorithm took the teachers' recommended grades and used them only to rank the students at that school. The actual grades were calculated based on past years' performance for each school. So if you were the top performer at a low-ranking school, your grade would be in line with top performers at that school in previous years.

No. The system aimed for no nationwide grade inflation. When it then took a number of private school’s predictions at face value (no alteration if you paid for a small class size), meaning fewer high grades available for other schools. So lots of state schools had across the board drops from previous years.

Re: Why did the A-level algorithm say no?

#142

Post by makomk » Tue, Aug 18, 2020, 8:43 PM UTC

Certhas wrote: post #102

mjburgess wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's hard not to be sceptical that this wasn't intentional and class-motivated. It's incredibly easy "not to be sceptical". The teacher's predicted grades are, on average, unprecedented . And represent many times greater than any previous yoy increase. This is far less true at top-performing schools where teachers are predicting far more consistent grades (by the very nature of being a top performing school). Teach…

It's not obvious that predicted grades are categorically worse than the system they put in place though, is it? In some aggregate statistics we can see them perform worse but exams and grading aren't about averages at school level but individual achievement. A prediction systems that doesn't take students prior achievements into account is just obviously defective here. And that matters especially if it locks out a w…

We're going to have a demonstration of what happens if everyone just gets the predicted grades and 2020 becomes an outlier year, because the government did a u-turn and it happened. So far, top-tier universities don't have the space to admit everyone who meets their offer requirements, the lower-tier universities are likely to not have enough students to remain financially viable due to everyone going to the top-tier ones, it's likely that the former will be ameliorated somewhat by removing the cap on admissions but this will make the latter worse, and it's all a huge mess. Every part of this was predictable, but none of it was explained by the press - which had been pushing the idea that everyone should be able to get their predicted grades - until it actually happened, because they were more interested in blaming the Government than accurately describing the pros and cons of the different options. Now the BBC is pushing for an inquiry as their headline front-page story, as though there was some kind of secret malfeasance to be uncovered rather than a set of bad options with really obvious, unavoidable tradeoffs: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-53826305

Re: Why did the A-level algorithm say no?

#143

Post by kitd » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:22 PM UTC

Emma_Goldman wrote: post #120

kitd wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teachers predict grades all the time. It's part of how student progress is tracked. We are constantly being told what level our kids are at and predicted level at exam time. Part of the problem is that teachers often push the "prediction" slightly higher as a means of motivating the student. Now those predictions are being used as the real deal. I am pretty convinced that most teachers with more than superficial expe…

Nonsense. There has always been a divide in the UK between public schools that try and predict grades accurately and private schools that game the system to maximise their students' chances of acceptance. I don't think teachers, or anyone else, can reliably predict results. I got the equivalent of an A* in most of my of my AS exams, but because I had bad GCSEs my results were ranked down for my predicted grades to AA…

The teachers don't play a part in downgrading based on past results, only on grade prediction based on current performance.

I'm glad you got the grades you wanted eventually, but the finger needs to be pointed in the correct direction.