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How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

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Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#151

Post by hungryhobo »

libertine wrote: post #94
evancox100 wrote: post #17

Anyone else catch this? First: “The Chinese government says its distant-water fishing fleet, or those vessels that travel far from China’s coast, numbers roughly 2,600, but other research, such as this study by the Overseas Development Institute (ODI), puts this number closer to 17,000”. Several paragraphs later: “More recently, the Chinese government has stopped calling for an expansion of its distant-water fishing…

>Why would you need to announce a plan to reduce your fleet to below 3,000 if it’s only “officially“ at 2,700? Is this a case of inconsistent propaganda? That's the thing about lies. At first glance is the perfect solution, you simply lie and the problem goes away. The tricky part is when the lies start you add up and you need to keep track of it, and/or when the lie is easily observable. I think this is a bit of bot…

You are basing your entire observation on an inaccurate translation.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#152

Post by justicezyx »

jaybeeayyy wrote: post #144
snarf21 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The more these discussions progress, the more I wonder if there is really only one solution. We need less people. Trying to convince 8 billion people to do something like never eat meat or fish seems like an impossible goal. We need to raise the standard of living in countries that reproduction rates > 2. We could also remove tax breaks for kids after the second in developed countries to mitigate the incentives for e…

Overpopulation is a racist myth. Developed countries use far more resources and waste significantly more food than developing nations and wealthy people have a larger footprint than their working class counterparts. https://wwf.panda.org/knowledge_hub/all_publications/living_... https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/01/chart-of-the-day-thes... https://theconversation.com/emissions-inequality-there-is-a-...

This is one of the question that every such discussion about population management wanted to avoid.

Understandably, it's much harder to ask people to reduce their current way of life.

But technology still is the key here.

US household energy consumption actually dropped, resulting into overall leveled national consumption total [1]

[1] https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/use-of-energy/homes.php

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#154

Post by [deleted] »

oblio wrote: post #126
crucio wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Typical response of HN to downvote comments like the parents, just because it's doesn't suit their own lifestyle.

I didn't downvote him but I think I know why he was downvoted. Denying human reality doesn't work. Remember the Prohibition?

[deleted]

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#155

Post by ephemeralism »

zwaps wrote: post #106
MichaelApproved wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This statement can be used to describe so many countries, it’s odd you’re just saying it about the Chinese govt.

China asserts its power to the detriment of neighboring countries in almost every aspect of life. Their disregard for others and for the environment is staggering and on a staggering scale. There are very few countries who can even come close to that - probably only the US qualifies. Even then, China has twice the CO2 emissions than the US, more than three times the emissions of the entire EU, and more than a magnitu…

Are you in all honesty trying to argue that it would be fair and just if a Chinese person was only allowed to emit one tenth of that of a German person?

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#156

Post by justicezyx »

harikb wrote: post #148
dis-sys wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shanghai's population size is 23-24 million, it is undisputed. They have a plan to limit that to 25 million by 2035. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-shanghai-population... According to your logic, they are lying about the population size of Shanghai as well? LOL

For boats, natural state is a static population. Boats don’t reproduce. This is where the comparison falls apart

What? Cannot boats be manufactured at all?

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#157

Post by freeopinion »

sidlls wrote: post #92
goodcanadian wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To limit future growth?

The "by" in "by 2021" implies the restriction is currently in breach. This may be a matter of translation differences, but I doubt it. It's more likely that the lying left hand doesn't have its story straight with the lying right hand of the CCP propaganda units.

You're going to base your argument on one word of a summary from somebody else of a statement made in a different language?

If you're that itchy for a quarrel, just have at it.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#158

Post by RhodesianHunter »

nemo44x wrote: post #141
geddy wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great, meat SHOULD cost a fortune. The actual cost of meat is not what you pay for it, the only reason it’s even affordable is because the taxpayer shoulders the burden of the farm subsidies. Cut those out and a $5 Big Mac would cost almost $15. Add to that the environmental impact, insane water usage, and the fact that meat production will continue to destroy economies through pandemics, and it should cost 10-15x mo…

Most people in society like meat so it makes sense we subsidize it. This is progressive. Otherwise only the wealthy could eat meat. The wealthy actually pay more to eat meat as they pay the majority of the taxes that go into these subsidies so nearly everyone can afford meat in the market. Once again, this is progressive. Just like roads. Most people in society want to be able to freely travel where they want and whe…

This is all well and good until the negative externalities overcome the benefits. We are past that point.

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#159

Post by [deleted] »

La1n wrote: post #147
searchableguy wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably not sustainable. If everyone start consuming at the same rate as an average person from a developed country, world would run out of resources in no time.

Doesn't that indicate that overconsumption, not overpopulation, is the problem.

[deleted]

Re: How China’s Expanding Fishing Fleet Is Depleting the World’s Oceans

#160

Post by Maximus9000 »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #139
La1n wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Salmon is general is a bad fish to farm because it consumes more protein than it produces. That counts for all animals, no?

Ya. I’m not sure why you are being downvoted but with animals you always get out less than you put in. Plants are the same way, but can grab other inputs (solar, minerals from the ground). Animal husbandry is a great way of converting inputs unfit for human consumption (animal feed) into something that is (meat) but it’s never very efficient.

> Animal husbandry is a great way of converting inputs unfit for human consumption (animal feed) into something that is (meat) but it’s never very efficient.

Ideally, yes. In practice, we feed animals mostly things that we ourselves could eat ourselves - like corn, soy, and grains. Sure, you can find cute examples of cattle eating grass on rocky soil... but around 99% of animals are not grown that way... they are grown in factory farms where they're fed soy, corn, and grains.

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