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Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

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191–200 of 313 posts

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#191
post #8

I'm in agreement. nVidia's history of not playing nicely with others does not make this sound like a good deal, especially for entrenched ARM vendors. (Apple won't be phased; they basically design everything themselves, so they don't really even care about the direction of ARM or the architecture. They could hard fork tomorrow, or two years ago, and nobody will notice since they're entirely vertically integrated.) Bu…

Why don’t Apple buy ARM?

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#192

He's absolutely right. Unless there is a 100% firewall between ARM and Nvidia then Nvidia will influence ARM to move in directions that help Nvidia's wider business and not the ARM ecosystem as a whole - and that will adversely affect everyone who uses an ARM CPU - and that's basically everyone. I don't believe that such a firewall is possible in any event. Who will enforce it? For those who are saying that it's grea…

I agree that this deal is good for Nvidia only and will hurt ARM CPU usage. Nvidia is right now not in the same league as Intel/Apple, but having the most successful consumer and corporate GPU business along with control of Arm architecture CPUs puts them in the same league in my opinion. That kind of dominance is never good for consumers. Having worked for a company that was acquired and became a daughter company, s…

Nvidia are worth more than Intel.

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#193
post #8

I'm in agreement. nVidia's history of not playing nicely with others does not make this sound like a good deal, especially for entrenched ARM vendors. (Apple won't be phased; they basically design everything themselves, so they don't really even care about the direction of ARM or the architecture. They could hard fork tomorrow, or two years ago, and nobody will notice since they're entirely vertically integrated.) Bu…

> "Apple ... could hard fork tomorrow, or two years ago, and nobody will notice" Could they really do this? Start making incompatible designs? I would have thought that Apple's ARM architecture license would include terms to preclude incompatible forks.

>I would have thought that Apple's ARM architecture license would include terms to preclude incompatible forks.

For an ordinary licensee you might think so, but Apple may well have special terms, given that they co-founded ARM

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Also, it's odd that they refer to the new stuff as Apple Silicon. Apple supposedly pays intel more for their CPUs than other OEM to avoid having their sticker on Macs; So I don't see this as odd, it's usual Apple branding tactic and from the looks of it(ARM being under threat of sale) it seems to be a wise decision as an average Apple customer wouldn't mind if it switches the architecture for its silicon.

I don't think Intel stickers are mandetory. Some other OEM don't have them either.

Intel gives you a discount for putting stickers on there though.

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#195
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most cynical view would be that they could not reup licenses for competitors.

Wouldn't they be forced into RAND? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_and_non-discriminat...

Afaict that seems to be an agreement that a patent holder enters into a third party with to promise to license their patents to implementors of the standard. In this case there is no standard, just the patents and associates technology, so I'm not sure that applies. I would be shocked though if big players didn't have similar long term agreements with Arm.

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#196
post #191
post #8

I'm in agreement. nVidia's history of not playing nicely with others does not make this sound like a good deal, especially for entrenched ARM vendors. (Apple won't be phased; they basically design everything themselves, so they don't really even care about the direction of ARM or the architecture. They could hard fork tomorrow, or two years ago, and nobody will notice since they're entirely vertically integrated.) Bu…

Why don’t Apple buy ARM?

They don't need too. They were a cofounder, and have a perpetual arch license

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was the apple gpu fiasco. Apple laptop GPUs were failing at an extraordinary rate in 2010-2011, and Apple were getting harangued in the media about it (which was justified). Apple eventually announced a program to cover replacement of the GPUs, but it was very delayed. I'm 100% convinced the delay was caused by Nvidia refusing to accept responsibility. When the program was released, in order to have the repair…

Apple also refuses to sign the kernel extension necessary for NVidia GPU drivers to run. NVidia had made a GPU driver for High Sierra, but literally a version later Apple locked down the kernel so that only signed drivers could be loaded. Anyone who was using Nvidia GPUs through, say, an external GPU box got screwed.

I had really hoped that the external GPU thing would takeoff, and give us a good option for gaming on Macs. I bought the dev kit, and it was nothing but a headache, which stopped working at High Sierra too, because they stopped supporting TB2. I'm bitter about it. It really seems like we ought to be "there" by now, but it's starting to look like it will just never be a thing.

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#199

The Observer proposed an interesting solution last weekend: "The government could offer a foundational investment of, say, £3bn-£5bn and invite other investors — some industrial, some sovereign wealth funds, some commercial asset managers — to join it in a coalition to buy Arm and run it as an independent quoted company, serving the worldwide tech industry..." https://news.slashdot.org/story/20/08/10/0358216/should-t…

I feel like with the current political climate in the UK this solution is fairly unlikely to happen.

Actually the UK government has started taking stakes in technology firms where it deems it has a strategic interest. [1]

I can easily see the man now running the UK (Dominic Cummings) deciding to take a stake in ARM. Maybe other ARM customers would also be willing to take (non controlling) stakes to keep it away from Nvidia (Apple of course used to be a big shareholder).

[1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-53279783

Re: Arm co-founder: Sale to Nvidia would be a disaster

#200

The Observer proposed an interesting solution last weekend: "The government could offer a foundational investment of, say, £3bn-£5bn and invite other investors — some industrial, some sovereign wealth funds, some commercial asset managers — to join it in a coalition to buy Arm and run it as an independent quoted company, serving the worldwide tech industry..." https://news.slashdot.org/story/20/08/10/0358216/should-t…

No, no, no. Government should not be in the business of picking winners and losers and this is more about denying someone else that benefiting the whole. Oh its wrapped up in pretty paper with a ribbon on it but the true reason is they don't want "those people" to have it. (being Nvidia but I am certain there are a few more suitors they don't like either)
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