Live data from Hacker News

Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

medium.com

331–340 of 417 posts

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know several people making $350k at companies like Lyft two years out of undergrad.

That doesn’t negate my point that you still make more than most developers in the US outside of the HN SV bubble writing CRUD apps or bespoke internal apps that will never see the light of day outside of the company. Go to salary.com and pick any major city not on the west coast.

The person in question works on deployment tools at Lyft, which is the definition of an internal tool though.

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#332

> I have been inexorably pushed away from GCP, towards cloud agnosticism. On a side note I think this is what all of us should be aiming for. Every time someone on a team I'm working for starts trying to use some very complex tool that a SaaS/cloud has built for us I always urged them to look for a simpler solution. Do you really need AWS Lambda/kinesis/etc or can you write your code and deploy it onto our cluster as…

It's tough to avoid the time savings that vendor lock-in buys you these days. I have had to grudgingly accept that, despite the fact that I absolutely hate giving in to it. Look at what Apple has done with lock-in (or Google for that matter in other areas of the ecosystem) and you can see the reasons why.

However you can take steps that even when you give in to lock in, you structure your code/projects so that switching to another standard is straightforward: include non-vendor build scripts that would work on any Docker/VPS/baremetal server, isolate the locked-in config and scripts from the rest of the app as much as possible (even if it means running separate external scripts to execute them), etc.

Once you've done it a couple times you build up a suite of small tools and it gets easier.

I got bit hard by Zeit/Vercel, and then by GCP, and then by AWS. All of them do one thing or another to manage to find a way to extract more money. My goal is to make it so that if one day I decide we simply need to leave the platform, we can at a minimum of effort.

Because this actually does happen 1-2 times a year, thanks to exactly the issues raised by OP, it's paid dividends to put in the small time it takes to keep things mostly agnostic on the code side.

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#333
post #244
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk, DO is adding a lot of managed services lately so it doesn't feel like they're going for the simple, well implemented commodity play for the long run.

Managed services are where the money is. :)

Managed services are where the lock-in is; or perhaps more generously, where the "increased friction to change providers" arises.

If your deployment is nothing more than scp from the post-build products on Github, you can use literally any server anywhere with SSH access. No lock in.

But if your deployment is a button click from inside a DO managed service, well... you're SOL if you want to move. You have to build all the stuff you avoided building before (the time savings and therefore money savings).

I really feel like some combination of the two should be possible. I've not yet seen a host come along that offers it. No large company would because they want reliable revenue generated due to lock in.

I've thought about building it. The older I get the more it interests me. I've got all the basic scripts to make it work. Maybe I'll dive in one of these days..

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#334
post #66

> Let’s say hypothetically that Apple was dumb enough to pull a Guido van Rossum, and declare that Swift 6.0 is backwards-incompatible with Swift 5.0, much in the way that Python 3 is incompatible with Python 2. Damn, I was waiting for this. The whole essay was a setup for this paragraph. Reframes the argument using a shared traumatic experience for everyone. This humanizes the effect, we all know someone that lost s…

I don't get the Python3 bw-incompatibility hate. Getting rid of cruft is literally the only way to get rid of cruft. It's literally the Pythonic to not have cruft. I dread the day Python will be as bloated as C++ or Java, neither that dare to remove things.

What cruft did py3 remove from py2?

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stop comparing yourself to others and work on yourself. Look inward, not outward. You make six figures at a top tech company and you’re bitterly complaining because you think you’re entitled to more, and in the same breath you’re chastising Google’s pretentious culture? There’s a lot of irony there. Focus on improving yourself and don’t get caught up in comparing yourself to others.

The only thing to see looking inward is a void. I see too many people talking about their Tahoe Google offsites (jbd@ on twitter claims a bunch of her coworkers just work from Tahoe during ski season) or their Colorado skiing weekends. Anyways, hypocrisy doesn't mean I'm wrong, and I think its valid to be mad that I'm seen as inferior daily.

[deleted]

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In my opinion, they have rejected some of the greatest students I have ever taught There's no question that Google is happy to have false-negatives in interviews. > I believe they purposefully taret the type of people who think working at Google makes you a fundamentally better person than anyone else why would they do this? And, if they do this, how are they generally speaking so successful? (this is also an amusi…

And, if they do this, how are they generally speaking so successful? The usual recipe for success in tech: competitors who are even less competent. See also: how Microsoft dominated personal computing back in the day.

Then this would imply that selecting for people who want to work at Google, instead of the "best candidate" is a valid strategy because it leads to better outcomes.

Again I think this whole line of thinking is nonsense, but even if you take it at face value, it still doesn't make sense.

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#337

Clearly author is making things up - there were no gummy sharks in micro kitchens. Sergey spoke at lengths about this. > I considered using Google Cloud Bigtable for my online game, but it costs an estimated $16,000/year for an empty Bigtable on GCP. I’m not saying they’re gouging you Ok, but they are

https://techcrunch.com/2020/04/07/google-cloud-makes-it-chea...

Cool so i can build a three node cockroach/tidb/tikv cluster that will have much higher reliability with the same performance characteristics for less money. Sounds like they still gouging you.

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#338
post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for taking the time to list them out, didn't spot those in the article. Personally, I think most of them seem quite sensible. Having a 'support everything forever' approach is obviously going to impose a huge burden on the teams who maintain this stuff which is then going to limit the ability to make anything better. The depreciation notices generally seem pretty good (12-15 months notice by the looks of it, s…

> Having a 'support everything forever' approach is obviously going to impose a huge burden on the teams who maintain this stuff which is then going to limit the ability to make anything better And yet AWS is doing just that while innovating at the same time.

AWS depreciate things too, though. For example https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-s3-path-deprecation-...

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#339
post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've always passed interviews that focused on behavioral aspects, I've frequently struggled in algorithm focused loops (bombed 2/4 in my Google onsite because, again, I'm intellectually inferior). Besides, until recently G didn't include any behavioral loops. > "compared to a very small subset of people I have failed" Compared to nearly everyone at elite universities I have absolutely failed. I'm sure some of them wi…

Even here you have many false assumptions though. For instance, the Harvard median new grad salary is 69k [1]. So you’re wrong in your assertion that compared to nearly everyone at elite universities you have failed. By your own definition of success, compared to most (by definition of median) people at elite universities, you have succeeded, and it’s they who have failed. You also have an implicit assumption that pe…

The perspective is inverted. From the perspective of a Harvard/Stanford/CMU/MIT undergrad working at Amazon is failing, which is nothing to say of IBM or Cisco (this is what I've understood after talking to several). I'd wager that the median new grad TC for Harvard CS students is at least twice that.

Re: Dear Google Cloud: Your Deprecation Policy Is Killing You

#340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's total compensation including everything. My base is only around $109k or so. I'm not in California or NYC and I joined out of college so base isn't as good as industry hires. I fully understand shaming $150k, new grads at Google make $180-$210k.

I specifically said that I was not shaming $150k. You graduated from college and are now making more than most developers in the US and you work at a big tech company. You have the opportunity to leverage that and either get promoted from within or change jobs. Are you really struggling making $150K straight out of college? You graduated from a state school (as did I) you probably don’t have that much debt. For conte…

>You have the opportunity to leverage that and either get promoted from within or change jobs.

I think the real problem is I'm not capable of doing so, at least according to the fair labor market.

> Are you really struggling making $150K straight out of college? You graduated from a state school (as did I) you probably don’t have that much debt.

I don't have any debt, I just have a really pathetic savings rate and a really low net worth compared to nearly everyone I know, including folks that didn't do "the grind" that I did. I'll probably not be able to retire or own a car, much less own a house someday.

Post reply on HN