Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus • Hacker News Board

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#461

Post by 6gvONxR4sf7o » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 4:57 PM UTC

chongli wrote: post #105

bob33212 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The value offered by colleges is not just an education. It is 4 years of living away from home experiencing whatever floats your boat ( frats, independence, parties, sports, friends, etc... ). There is virtually no demand for online only classes above a 5k/year price point. There is a similar situation with private schools. Some of the demand comes from the fact that it is also a babysitting service, forced social gr…

It is 4 years of living away from home experiencing whatever floats your boat ( frats, independence, parties, sports, friends, etc... ) I’m in university right now. I just finished a term of online classes. I’ve definitely witnessed those benefits being enjoyed by other students but I haven’t had the time to enjoy them myself; my program is simply too difficult for that. The most I’ve enjoyed is going out for drinks…

> The ones joining frats, partying constantly, playing sports and all that must have trivial classes. Either that or they’re already so rich and privileged that they can afford to fail courses and keep going.

I don't know why you're assuming this, but I'm a little insulted. I was an NCAA athlete and a common refrain I always heard was that the most valuable skill you get from it is incredible time management. I didn't kill time on sites like HN or reddit or facebook (the only social network at the time). We partied a decent amount too. About half of the particular people I played and partied with now have doctorates from world class institutions. Nearly all of us have STEM degrees.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#462

Post by wwweston » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 5:11 PM UTC

yostrovs wrote: post #445

mindslight wrote: post #428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fundamental problem is that music teachers tend to care about music, while administrators tend to care about protecting their own jobs. So any budget cuts tend to cut services, rather than reducing the overhead. This dynamic plays out everywhere with overgrown middle management.

Music teachers care about their jobs just as much as administrators. It's just that administrators make the big decisions and they care about their jobs more than the jobs of others.

This seems to imply that once managerialism metastasizes in an organization, it's chronic and likely fatal to any other mission.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#463

Post by heavyset_go » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 6:57 PM UTC

stordoff wrote: post #432

heavyset_go wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In reality, they didn't need to save the minimal room and board fees of a state school; they were mostly just cowards I don't know when the last time you've lived in dorms was, but they're glorified summer camps for adolescents. Having meal plans and an RA aren't exactly badges of courage. If you don't come from means or have parents that will help pay for you to move out, then taking on living expenses to study is…

In the UK, we had a maintenance book where you could report things that were broken (even things as trivial as a light bulb - you were told _not_ to replace them on your own), porters who you could give you a spare key if you lost yours and were responsible for external security, catered meals three times a day that were cheap enough that cooking for yourself was fairly pointless from a financial standpoint unless it…

Would you be comfortable having to pay for that experience decades later or past retirement? A lot of people in the US are in that boat, and the debts are non-dischargable.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#464

Post by dehrmann » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 7:51 PM UTC

mensetmanusman wrote: post #381

jmull wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Man, this is very tough. I think the problem is (and I very much hope I am wrong!) that an outbreak will occur and your university will still have the financial problems. And also some more sick and dead people. (All from a US perspective) There's been a crazy notion floating around from the start on this, that we can either keep our normal activities/economy (jobs, businesses, schools, etc) or deal with the pandemic…

Nope, even with 100% lockdown, it still spreads because we aren’t an island country. It even got to Auckland now, through freight! You can only delay the inevitable (unless a vaccine is developed in the next few months)

> through freight

Did they confirm this? I could also see issues with someone asymptomatic who was quarantined, but was at the 99th percentile for incubation period. With an R0 near 1, with enough people, you could miss the virus for even a few months.

It's really hard to contain, and NZ will likely be dealing with case like this on and off until there's a vaccine.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#465

Post by dehrmann » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 7:55 PM UTC

mindslight wrote: post #428

csa wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s sad, since that seems more flesh that fat to me. The real “fat” is the admin bloat at most universities. Most schools will continue to be in a precarious financial situation until that fat is cut, imho.

The fundamental problem is that music teachers tend to care about music, while administrators tend to care about protecting their own jobs. So any budget cuts tend to cut services, rather than reducing the overhead. This dynamic plays out everywhere with overgrown middle management.

As far as students are concerned, a bigger problem than administrator pay is professors who are more interested in teaching than research, and even when professors are interested in teaching, they might not be good teachers.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#466

Post by dehrmann » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 8:02 PM UTC

0xffff2 wrote: post #162

chongli wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is 4 years of living away from home experiencing whatever floats your boat ( frats, independence, parties, sports, friends, etc... ) I’m in university right now. I just finished a term of online classes. I’ve definitely witnessed those benefits being enjoyed by other students but I haven’t had the time to enjoy them myself; my program is simply too difficult for that. The most I’ve enjoyed is going out for drinks…

>The ones joining frats, partying constantly, playing sports and all that must have trivial classes. Either that or they’re already so rich and privileged that they can afford to fail courses and keep going. I disagree completely. Some people are just inhumanly capable of balancing everything. One of the smartest people I met while in school was in a sorority and partied hard . She was also extremely successful acade…

> ...in a sorority

When I was in college from 2002 to 2006, the thing I heard about sororities was that joining one usually helped a GPAs, and they were really good about keeping an archive of old exams and notes.

Joining a frat hurt your GPA.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#467

Post by FuckButtons » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 9:36 PM UTC

jnwatson wrote: post #100

tyingq wrote: post #9

My son's state university is forcing students to return in person. I fully expect a notable outbreak in some college to start a wave of media noise, followed by all the universities sending everyone back home again. Sucks because students are signing leases, moving crap, buying meal plans, etc, right now. Aside from the obvious safety issues.

"Forcing". There's no one forcing anybody to go to college. This would be a fine time to take a gap year.

And do what? Get a job? go traveling? This would be a fucking awful time to take a gap year, the fact that this seems to be the prevailing solution on here is indicative of just how out of touch some of the readership is.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#468

Post by ineedasername » Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 10:15 PM UTC

spbaar wrote: post #458

ineedasername wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You won't change the education issues in the US at the very top of the pyramid. The problems with US education begin at day 1 of kindergarten and the complete balkanization of curriculums both from state to state and often between different school districts in the same state.

There wasn't even a coherent line throughout elementary and middle school in Orange County. One year, 1/3 of our curriculum was geology, which was 90% of what we covered last year. More flabbergasted than concerned. It was more stressful because I was nervous about which classes were going to be hard and which easy and then that curve ball comes along and i dont know what to think!

Yes, my children are in grammar school. First: They focus almost exclusively on Math and Reading. Important subjects to be sure, but history, science, social studies etc are little more than an afterthought.

And as you said, a significant part of the begining of the year simply covers what was done the previous year. I'd prefer they simply provided a summer curriculum of 2 or 3 hours a week of such work if review is necessary, which would also eliminate the complete discontinuity from one scho year to the next. I'm fortunate that We can do so on our own, piecing together that sort of thing, but plenty of working parents have neither the time, or ability, or inclination to compose their own mini summer curriculum.7

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#469

Post by onecommentman » Sun, Aug 16, 2020, 12:53 AM UTC

jnwatson wrote: post #100

tyingq wrote: post #9

My son's state university is forcing students to return in person. I fully expect a notable outbreak in some college to start a wave of media noise, followed by all the universities sending everyone back home again. Sucks because students are signing leases, moving crap, buying meal plans, etc, right now. Aside from the obvious safety issues.

"Forcing". There's no one forcing anybody to go to college. This would be a fine time to take a gap year.

If you are a freshman or sophomore and you have a modicum of self-discipline and motivation, it can be a great strategy. You know those core courses at which you want to excel but will suck up most your time? Do you realize how much easier they will be if you’ve already read the textbook twice over and listened to an online lecture course or two? Maybe even audited an actual online course from another university? Maybe found out what the assignments will be and did most of them. A C in the online audited course at a community college will lead to an A when you actually take it next year and with half the effort. If you get through as much of this year’s core course material as you can stand, keep on going with next year’s courses. "Finish" organic chem the first half-year? "Do" biochem the second. If you nail half the concepts before you take the course, you can focus on the other concepts during the course. Professors start noticing you because you did so well. You bring up advanced topics in conversations and get invited to work in the lab. You get a good rep and the benefit of the doubt. Bonus tip: find a professor whose support you’d like to have and read some of their recent papers or watch their presentations. Contact them with good questions about their work. Free time is an amazing ally if you use it right.

No, I’m not an Asian tiger mom...wrong gender, wrong ethnicity.

Re: Stanford cancels plans to bring half of undergrads back to campus

#470

Post by doctor_eval » Sun, Aug 16, 2020, 12:56 AM UTC

ketamine__ wrote: post #417

doctor_eval wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 20 year old died of cv this week here in Victoria. Everybody is at risk, it’s just that the curve “favours” older people. You know, like professors, admin staff, mature students, parents and grandparents, ...

Was he obese? I only ask because many of the younger patients have comorbities that make them vulnerable to many diseases. And vaccines don't work as well for the obese either.

It doesn’t matter. The problem is that the people who don’t get sick, make other people sick.