Earlier quoted context omitted.
* 10% of the optimists make money
The optimists get more than one at bat.
And pessimists don’t?
Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
51–60 of 322 posts
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
Won at electric, won at space, won at paypal. Salty comment ? Sounds like a HN comment
Are you asserting the space and electric ventures were not funded by taxpayers?
They were actually not. And in the cases tax payer funding was involved it was not some sort of blank check.
SpaceX got to orbit and was financed privately. Only once SpaceX had proven that capability, they were selected by the government to deliver cargo to ISS. SpaceX had to submit a competitive bid and was selected because they were the cheapest. SpaceX has fully executed on this contract and it was by far cheaper then any other transport to ISS service, including Russian, European, Japanese and US competition (Orbital ATK).
During its whole live, government contracts were never more then half SpaceX contracts and SpaceX was and is a viable buissness without government contracts. The main financing for SpaceX has been privately raised money.
NASA was a helpful costumer to SpaceX and helped it grow faster but calling that 'taxpayer funded' is a waste overstatement.
Tesla equally was privately funded and operate like that for much of its early history. The DoE loan only started rolling in by 2010 and helped them fund Model S. This loan was fully payed back with interest. Again, the majority of funding threw-out Tesla history is privately raised, including Roadster, Model X, Model 3, Model Y programs.
Its important to not that GM, Ford and Fiat-Chrysler received far, far, far more resources in the 2008-2012 timeframe and most of that has unlike Tesla not been payed back. GM of course had to be saved totally by the government.
Calling Tesla 'taxpayers funded' is just complete nonsense.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
Elon seems to have moved on to non-vaccuum underground tunnels via The Boring Company, which is actually doing real projects. Though apparently there are still Hyperloop competitions planned. The 2020 one was supposed to be "in a 10km vacuum tunnel with a curve", though that may be stalled by, well, obvious current events. https://tunnelinsider.com/the-2020-hyperloop-competition-wil... No one else seems to have quite…
> Elon seems to have moved on to non-vaccuum underground tunnels via The Boring Company So, a subway?
No, more like a PRT system, "people-mover", or Busway.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not if it’s underground. You can get the right of way much cheaper depending on what’s on top.
Ok, so how is this cheaper than high-speed rail in a tunnel? It seems to me that hyperloop is high speed rail with the addition of a vacuum, which gets you higher speed. The additional requirement of a giant vacuum tube should make the system cost more, not less. Personally, I’m rooting for Elon Musk to figure out how to make tunnels cheaply with the Boring Company, so we can take that tech and use it to build a bunc…
It uses a much smaller tunnel.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
They'll be stuck in a tunnel. Is that worse than being stuck in the desert?
Yes, if you have no ventilation. If you're above ground you'd just pop an emergency hatch in the tube. You can't do that underground. I'd also point out that a hyperloop tunnel is a much worse place to be stuck in than a normal tunnel. In a normal tunnel there is room to walk alongside the tracks. In a hyperloop tunnel there is virtually no room between the car and tunnel - maybe an inch or two, tops.
You might not want to pop the emergency hatch when you're surrounded by vacuum.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, if you have no ventilation. If you're above ground you'd just pop an emergency hatch in the tube. You can't do that underground. I'd also point out that a hyperloop tunnel is a much worse place to be stuck in than a normal tunnel. In a normal tunnel there is room to walk alongside the tracks. In a hyperloop tunnel there is virtually no room between the car and tunnel - maybe an inch or two, tops.
You might not want to pop the emergency hatch when you're surrounded by vacuum.
Hatch in the tube, not the car.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you asserting the space and electric ventures were not funded by taxpayers?
They were actually not. And in the cases tax payer funding was involved it was not some sort of blank check. SpaceX got to orbit and was financed privately. Only once SpaceX had proven that capability, they were selected by the government to deliver cargo to ISS. SpaceX had to submit a competitive bid and was selected because they were the cheapest. SpaceX has fully executed on this contract and it was by far cheaper…
> Its important to not that GM, Ford and Fiat-Chrysler received far, far, far more resources in the 2008-2012 timeframe and most of that has unlike Tesla not been payed back
Most has not been paid back? What figures are you using for this? My understanding is that the bailout was ~$80bn, but the final cost to the government was approximately $9bn.
When people complain about Tesla being taxpayer funded, they're generally referring to EV incentives, not the DoE loan. Tesla has indeed been supported quite a lot in that way.
But even if you value the environment at $0, other car manufacturers are going to benefit just as much from at least the FITC, so the argument is transient at best.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Elon seems to have moved on to non-vaccuum underground tunnels via The Boring Company So, a subway?
But with cars. No, I'm not making this up. https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1285819565407002624
But... that’s just like shuttle taxis on the airport. Except underground.
Guess boring technology triumphs again.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why is hyperloop 1/20th the cost? It seems like the expensive parts of high-speed rail (acquiring the land and moving earth to make a long straight path) would also apply.
Not if it’s underground. You can get the right of way much cheaper depending on what’s on top.
If that were true, conventional rail would be built mostly in tunnels.
It is very much not.
Tunnels are used only when absolutely necessary to deal with terrain.
Re: Hyperloop: Pipes of Fancy
#60The mere fact that Musk is pushing it makes me very wary of betting against it. Sure he's not Tony Stark...but doesn't seem that far off either.