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How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

deprocrastination.co

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Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#201

Post by live1999 »

james_s_tayler wrote: post #146
Bedon292 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously you feel the medication is useful, but do you think just knowing vs the medication has any positive benefit? I have read dozens of articles online, and replies like yours and can always relate extremely well to all of the symptoms. Taken the online quizzes and all that. I am pretty much certain I have ADHD. And I have known for years. But, I have educated myself on it, understand how I work (or don't work)…

Emotional relief like "I'm not a shitty selfish person after all and it isn't my fault". But if you employ a tonne of ADHD coping mechanisms and they work for you it'll improve things a decent amount. I haven't tried CBT but it's a recommend approach. I'm trying (painfully slowly because it's not super interesting) to teach myself DBT to help with it too. Dx is only strictly required to get Rx but an additional benef…

Yes, thankyou for mentioning the differential diagnosis stuff, it's definitely a good idea to rule other things out. :)

I was wondering if I had ADHD; in all the online tests I score in the ADHD or borderline range. But it's just symptoms of my anxiety which is particularly bad at the moment. If I'd done the tests a year ago, the result would have been completely different.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#202

Post by RalfWausE »

I have an a bit different approach: Just stop this "self-optimization" bs and start being a human with all his flaws and failures. I think if you tinker to much with yourself and your flaws you are in danger of loosing yourself and become some sort of machine.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#203

Post by georgespencer »

live1999 wrote: post #201
james_s_tayler wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emotional relief like "I'm not a shitty selfish person after all and it isn't my fault". But if you employ a tonne of ADHD coping mechanisms and they work for you it'll improve things a decent amount. I haven't tried CBT but it's a recommend approach. I'm trying (painfully slowly because it's not super interesting) to teach myself DBT to help with it too. Dx is only strictly required to get Rx but an additional benef…

Yes, thankyou for mentioning the differential diagnosis stuff, it's definitely a good idea to rule other things out. :) I was wondering if I had ADHD; in all the online tests I score in the ADHD or borderline range. But it's just symptoms of my anxiety which is particularly bad at the moment. If I'd done the tests a year ago, the result would have been completely different.

There are a range of interrelated symptoms and experiences (e.g. autism, dyspraxia, dyslexia, anxiety), and part of the job of a good psychiatrist is to pick through these and make a determination.

An analogy you might be experienced with: imagine you're a product manager and you want to make a customer service person in your company twice as efficient as they are today. If you ask the CS person what you should work on for them, they might be able to give you some direction, but they don't know the full range of possible things that you can do for them. E.g. they might think "Well, I've got to type emails to customers so it would be useful for me to have a new support ticket load on my screen as soon as I'm finished with the last one." But you -- an expert -- might say "We can actually auto reply to some of these emails for you using a canned template!"

Self-diagnosing, and in particular self-diagnosing mental health and neuroatypicality issues, is a hard ask.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#204

Post by georgespencer »

james_s_tayler wrote: post #181
georgespencer wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Getting diagnosed this year changed my life too. This is awesome! > following what works specifically for ADHD e.g externalize information, externalize decision making etc. I bet everyone would love to hear a little more context around what this is, and how it impacted you, if you have the energy to share. (Me most of all!)

Don't leave it up to yourself to decide what to do and when. Find a way to put the environment in control. Pre-diagnosis I would try this and it wouldn't work that well or it would work for a short time then after the novelty wore off it'd stop working. Things like set an alarm/reminder for throwing out the rubbish. But then eventually you ignore it and swipe it away or you're dealing with something urgent that day e…

This is fantastic. Thanks for sharing. Do you have any recommended further reading? You could write a great essay on this, I bet.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#205

Post by hnick »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #200
hnick wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes when I am very emotionally upset or have a very negative task I want to avoid like studying, I will get the sudden urge to clean or work on a similar low-brainpower project (which is not something that comes naturally to me in normal times). If I were merely trying to feel better I'd just go for video games or something like I normally do, but there must be something else going on that directs me to focus o…

Feelings are complex. Personally, at any given time, I have two or three of sideprojects, videogames and TV shows I could focus on, each. But when I procrastinate, I end up reading HN or some subreddit or something similar, instead of coding my side projects or playing a game I've been waiting to play for the past year. I've traced that to feelings of guilt . I can't enjoy a videogame if I feel I'm only using it to e…

Yeah I can connect with that feeling of guilt. Sometimes I'll need an escape when something needs doing. So I'll browse around Reddit or play a video game, but not an involved, captivating one, but something like a simpler puzzle game so I can feel like I'm not totally abandoning the stuff I'm meant to do.

It's really odd and I'm better off just burning an hour or two on a more intense form of distraction and getting it out of my system. I've found it's worse when my wife is home, I guess it's an urge to keep up appearances, even if she doesn't really care? But when she's out of town I think I get more done just because I chunk time for work and play more effectively.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#206

Post by georgespencer »

Aerroon wrote: post #187
georgespencer wrote: post #25

It’s clearly not the case for everyone, but I struggled for an extended period of time with a few things in my personal and professional life: 1. Remarkable focus in topics which interest me and remarkable lack of focus in topics which do not. 2. Leaving “must do” tasks in areas of little interest until the very last moment, resulting in a predictable lack of excellence in execution. 3. Periodic deep dives into topic…

I think #2 is actually great. Without this trigger things never got done for me. University taught me that failure is okay, which removed the trigger for me. End result was that things got even worse. I hope one day I'll be able to find a replacement for it.

> I think #2 is actually great.

Remember that there are a range of intensities to all of these symptoms!

A lot of people I know find that leaving things to the last minute can help them focus and they're good at assessing the time required to deliver something high quality.

For me it results in disaster more often than not.

> University taught me that failure is okay, which removed the trigger for me. End result was that things got even worse.

Ah sorry to hear that. Do you generally exhibit other symptoms consistent with others in this thread, or do you think it's just one area which you suffer in?

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#207

Post by georgespencer »

organsnyder wrote: post #155
wy35 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I may be conflating ADHD with my incredibly independent personality I think you are, to a degree. Serious ADHD is AWFUL to live with and there's barely any upside. > I can't sit down for long - so I just stand in meetings. It's nice that you can mitigate not being able to sit down for long by just standing, but for many people with ADHD, not being able to sit for long is more than just stance. It's because they can…

> Freedom? ADHD is incredibly suffocating. It's wanting to start doing something but feeling overpowered and locked-up. It's wanting to achieve long-term goals but feeling like you're constantly self-sabotaging yourself. It's making a plan in the morning, being unable to accomplish anything during the day, and furiously kicking yourself at night in an endless cycle of self-hatred. For me, ADHD is the complete opposit…

Can't tell if you have a diagnosis or not. If it would be useful to chat my email address is in my profile and a few people have already reached out. I'm not a doctor and can't diagnose you but I'm happy to hear about your experience and share where it chimes with mine.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#208

Post by georgespencer »

PoachedSausage wrote: post #193
georgespencer wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was daunting for me too. I had a series of private evaluations in London, and the proxy I used was to seek a consultant psychiatrist (just about as senior as they come) who had a longstanding relationship with his local NHS trust (hadn't jumped from one area to another), looked him up on the GMC (registry of doctors in the UK which would report malpractice or other issues), and asked for a telephone consultation…

For those of us in the UK, would you be able to recommend the consultant/practice? I have a private practice locally that specialises in ADHD but I've no idea about their reputation.

Sure! Best thing would be to email me on mistergeorgespencer+HN@gmail.com if that's OK! (And same goes to anyone who wants more detail.)

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#209

Post by agumonkey »

vitabenes wrote: post #54
pmoriarty wrote: post #43

Some time back, I read all I could on procrastination, and watched dozens of videos on it, and by far the best thing I found on it was this video by Tim Pychyl: [1] It focuses particularly on procrastination in graduate school, but is widely applicable elsewhere. One of the key insights that Pychyl, a psychologist who studies procrastination, had is that procrastination is not (as is commonly believed) a time managem…

Yes, Pychil's work is incorporated in our materials. This is the recipe for procrastination (according to us): 1. Think about a task - "I have to do _____." 2. Have an automatic negative reaction 2a. Negative thoughts - "I hate doing this,"... 2b Negative feelings - Feeling stressed, afraid,... 3. Procrastinate - Do something else to feel better. Procrastination is all about escaping negative emotions. Something make…

a few thoughts:

- how much of society is related to driving up or enforcing overcoming these avoidant reflexes

- the negative feeling is often due to a social obligation that may be distorded. You could renegotiate smaller chunks or different terms.. the idea is that in a different context you might approach it with lot more will.

ps: my current gig is in a national office and I could very well rebrand it as land-of-the-procrastinator. It's an endemic disease where nobody wanted to do things (the way they were asked), any newcomer will be dragged down, ensure a good status-low.

Re: How to stop procrastinating by using the Fogg Behavior Model

#210

Post by TeMPOraL »

hnick wrote: post #205
TeMPOraL wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feelings are complex. Personally, at any given time, I have two or three of sideprojects, videogames and TV shows I could focus on, each. But when I procrastinate, I end up reading HN or some subreddit or something similar, instead of coding my side projects or playing a game I've been waiting to play for the past year. I've traced that to feelings of guilt . I can't enjoy a videogame if I feel I'm only using it to e…

Yeah I can connect with that feeling of guilt. Sometimes I'll need an escape when something needs doing. So I'll browse around Reddit or play a video game, but not an involved, captivating one, but something like a simpler puzzle game so I can feel like I'm not totally abandoning the stuff I'm meant to do. It's really odd and I'm better off just burning an hour or two on a more intense form of distraction and getting…

> I've found it's worse when my wife is home, I guess it's an urge to keep up appearances, even if she doesn't really care? But when she's out of town I think I get more done just because I chunk time for work and play more effectively.

I've got exactly the same. I know she doesn't care, but the urge keep appearances is still there. I tend to schedule checking out videogames for those times when she takes our daughter to visit her parents - even though she would be fine with me taking a break to play games, I would feel guilty about not spending time with them instead.

Guilt is a funny thing.

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