> never underestimate the amount of money the FAANGs have to poach your talent. I really wish we'd stop using the word "poach". It's a loaded word with negative connotations, but what it really means here is "offer someone a better situation than you offered them". Employees have agency, they aren't wild elephants who need your "protection" from "predators" who just want to pay them more.
The thing that hits me is the "$500k+/year in the valley". Is this really a thing? Am I a giant dumbass for staying in Colorado? Even factoring in my stock grants, I'm nowhere close to that number.
Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
191–200 of 441 posts
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
Approximately 10 years ago, I was really unhappy with my work situation and was checking job postings. I found one that sounded right up my alley and I reached out to the agency that posted it. They told me that because I was working for another one of their clients, they wouldn't submit me for the job because they felt it was unethical. I responded that I wasn't owned by my employer and just as they were free to let…
FWIW, that is not how all agencies operate, unless they are under a contractual obligation. For example, some agencies only limit themselves to not representing a previously placed candidate if they are still the role where they were placed by the agency. Outside of that, if a candidate wants to move from one client company to another, the agency may even act as a catalyst, especially if the candidate would be a grea…
"We will do everything in our power to find you the employees you need, unless it might make one of our other clients unhappy."
This would be a disqualifying conflict of interest for a law firm.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#193Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If Google is willing to pay 200k above market rate This is not possible according to the usual definition of "market rate". If Google is willing to pay X, that is the market rate.
I disagree with your definition of "market rate", but let's suppose you're right: Do you not see it as a problem that Google alone decides the cost of entry to an entire market?
edit - I see how my post was misleading. I should have said X is a "lower bound" for the market rate.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#194Earlier quoted context omitted.
I really fail to see the distinction. If someone is willing to pay 600k for something, then the value of that thing on the market is 600k. That is what a market is.
The correlary is that McDonalds could offer free burgers for a year, they have enough money to handle the cost. They could do it just so that other business cant stay affloat. This doesn't mean that the market price of a McDonalds burger is $0
The market will correct very quickly, as competitors will immediately head over to McDonalds to purchase $\infty$ burgers at $0, killing MCD dead in seconds.
The moment McDonalds applies a purchase limit (Free burgers! Limit 5 per customer), the burgers have non-zero cost, as they require a person's time in order to purchase.
If McDonalds does have enough capital to buy long-term customers and kill off competition with free burgers, perhaps they should consider it. I assume that they've considered such a strategy on occasion and concluded that it isn't worth it. Burgers are probably worth more than $0 to McDonalds, too.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#195I agree with the author's point about using popular tech stacks to alleviate the ramp-up time for new hire productivity, but that is not the optimal solution. The optimal solution is for management to not let high-productivity talent from leaving - increase their comp to whatever offers they might get in the open market. That's how labor economic works - it's a market. Investment bank and management consulting figure…
Only failing companies in 2020 view their engineers as easily replaceable. That said, there are a lot of failing companies these days thanks to cheap and readily available debt.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#196I agree with the author's point about using popular tech stacks to alleviate the ramp-up time for new hire productivity, but that is not the optimal solution. The optimal solution is for management to not let high-productivity talent from leaving - increase their comp to whatever offers they might get in the open market. That's how labor economic works - it's a market. Investment bank and management consulting figure…
"The optimal solution is for management to not let high-productivity talent from leaving - increase their comp to whatever offers they might get in the open market." That might result in the engineer being paid more than the value of their contribution at their current employer. Many things could cause this, e.g. - the new employer is much more productive, can make better use of the engineer, and so can afford to pay…
As a hiring manager, though, I'm stuck in the middle between developers and executive leadership. Executives tend to form a notion of what different roles should be paid, and they just won't bend, even if it means losing talent and spending $1 million+ replacing them over time. The problem is that replacement cost is abstract and easy to ignore, whereas paying a single developer $500k/year to retain them feels very real. Never mind the fact that losing them means multiple projects will be derailed, you'll spend a year looking for a replacement to hire at twice their salary, that replacement will take 3 additional years to reach the same level of domain expertise, it turns out that replacement never takes on the same degree of leadership or earns the same level of trust from colleagues, and in the midst of all of this the absence of your top performer causes two other talented engineers to leave in the following year.
$500k starts to look reasonable in retrospect, but you'll never be able to sell it, so you'll do the above dance instead and spend more money in the end.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#197Earlier quoted context omitted.
I see this one as a different problem. If your team members who won the lotto would just give their two weeks and quit, then your company/team has a substantial morale/motivation problem. Such a company is not creating an environment where people enjoy being a part of it.
Yea sorry that's bullshit. I certainly don't need the stress of a job in my life if I have other options. I don't care how much I like my job, it's still a job and the only reason I'm doing it is to make money. Otherwise I'd be spending time with my family and doing hobbies, of which one would likely still be writing software. And I wouldn't expect anyone in that position to give me two weeks. Two weeks is about not…
IMO that makes them an asshole.
But, to your point, sure. If I have FU money then depending on a lot of things including what arrangements I could make with an employer, I might well choose not to work for someone else.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#198> never underestimate the amount of money the FAANGs have to poach your talent. I really wish we'd stop using the word "poach". It's a loaded word with negative connotations, but what it really means here is "offer someone a better situation than you offered them". Employees have agency, they aren't wild elephants who need your "protection" from "predators" who just want to pay them more.
Approximately 10 years ago, I was really unhappy with my work situation and was checking job postings. I found one that sounded right up my alley and I reached out to the agency that posted it. They told me that because I was working for another one of their clients, they wouldn't submit me for the job because they felt it was unethical. I responded that I wasn't owned by my employer and just as they were free to let…
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#199Earlier quoted context omitted.
The thing that hits me is the "$500k+/year in the valley". Is this really a thing? Am I a giant dumbass for staying in Colorado? Even factoring in my stock grants, I'm nowhere close to that number.
Keep in mind that the cost of living in silicon valley is drastically higher than Colorado. You can use something like https://www.nerdwallet.com/cost-of-living-calculator/compare... to estimate the difference and it's pretty staggering. You'd probably have to at least double your salary to consider moving.
Re: Developer won’t get hit by a bus, they’ll get hired by Netflix
#200Not only must you compensate your talent at the top of the market and then some (including generous equity), but you must give your employees an amazing work environment with excellent work/life balance, while providing something for them to work on that motivates them on an ideological level.
When any part of this aegis cracks, poaching has the potential to ravage your ranks.
I would say that in the case of especially valuable or world-class talent, it's the founder's responsibility to know as much as they can about that person, and to truly pitch them on a level that fully aligns across all dimensions of that person's life. Give them not only excellent comp, but fulfillment and purpose that is congruent or even symbiotic with their personal lives and overall ambitions.
Deep down, most people aren't pawns that you can simply acquire with a number and expect the highest quality work from.