Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

federalreserve.gov

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

411–420 of 431 posts

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#411

Post by novok »

randomdude402 wrote: post #402
novok wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What skeeves me out about zelle is there is no fraud protection unlike most other payment methods in the USA. So I'm going to continue to use venmo, credit cards, etc: https://techcrunch.com/2018/02/16/zelle-users-are-finding-ou...

When people started trying to pressure me to use Venmo, my research at the time led me to the conclusion that it offers no guarantee of fraud protection either. Just like PayPal before it, it's not a bank and doesn't have to follow any of the rules. How it's legal to operate in such a fashion is beyond my ability to understand, but that's my understanding of the situation.

Venmo & paypal have a reputation of helping you if there is a fraud dispute, zelle has the opposite. The difference between guarantee and practice.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#412

Post by Dobbs »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #348
Dobbs wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK if I want to send someone money to anyone in the UK I open the mobile app and input their sort and account number, type in the amount of money and hit send. Done. Similarly in the NL if I want to send someone money to anyone in the EuroZone I open my bank app type in their IBAN type in the amount of money and hit send. Done. Back in 2017 when I lived in the US this just wasn't possible. If I wanted to send…

Those transactions always make me nervous - is there a reason they don't have a step of showing the account name when you input the number? Like, I type 31-45-76 0452768934 and it says "Mr & Mrs Y O Mama" or "Notafraud & Co. Ltd." or whatever, as a confirmation?

We have this for IBAN payments within the NL, I can't speak for the rest of the EuroZone.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#413

Post by krageon »

ryaniscool wrote: post #372
dboreham wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than that if the amount is non-trivial. Wells Fargo won't allow you to send an amount over $10k instantly without physically entering a branch.

This is typical around the world. This is probably because it's a very practical way to limit losses if someone did gain access to your online banking. When I lived in Australia, which I believe has a very modern banking system, I couldn't instantly send more than $5k a day. The one time I needed to send more money, I was fine with going into a branch.

You can up the limits at any decent bank using some sort of MFA solution without physically going to a branch as if it's 1980.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#414

Post by _-___________-_ »

liuyong wrote: post #405
_-___________-_ wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I take issue with the word "improve" there. Whilst I definitely agree that a common language is valuable in many ways, it would be preferable if a common language could be achieved without a loss of diversity (i.e. additional to, rather than replacing, the existing languages). Different languages embody different cultures, and different ways of thinking. This diversity should be celebrated and embraced, not only as a…

Agreed. But this trend looks unstoppable,to most parents in Shanghai, even English is more important than local language. Maybe what happend in 2020 would change that...

Agreed - I have a few Shanghainese friends, and they tell me their parents discourage them from learning/speaking Shanghainese, since there is no "value" in doing so. They used to push them to learn English (but maybe that will change a little now). Perhaps they have a point, but when you're young and still good at learning language, you don't have to choose one or the other.

I have heard similar stories from Europeans coming from places with strong dialects / local languages, so it's not unique to China for sure.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#415

Post by krageon »

Dobbs wrote: post #412
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those transactions always make me nervous - is there a reason they don't have a step of showing the account name when you input the number? Like, I type 31-45-76 0452768934 and it says "Mr & Mrs Y O Mama" or "Notafraud & Co. Ltd." or whatever, as a confirmation?

We have this for IBAN payments within the NL, I can't speak for the rest of the EuroZone.

The name check isn't universally supported, so it is better to say that it is strictly optional.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#416

Post by arrayjumper »

sandGorgon wrote: post #229
arrayjumper wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree wholeheartedly. In my opinion, UPI has been an unmitigated success. Nearly everyone from a roadside street-food vendor to a 5 star hotel accepts UPI and it makes the whole flow of day-to-day payments entirely contactless which is especially useful with the COVID-19 situation. Now if only they could introduce some way to enable subscription payments, it'd be the cherry on top.

already live. its called UPI Autopay https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/startup/exclusive...

Ohh. Thanks for linking this. I'm excited for this.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#417

Post by tekknik »

withinboredom wrote: post #288
djsumdog wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My first job out of university was working for a debt collection firm that made its own ACH engine in Perl. I remember all the 99999s and headers and stuff. I didn't work very much on the engine though (thankfully). I was pretty shocked at just how far behind the American banking system was when I lived overseas for a bit. I wrote about it here: https://battlepenguin.com/tech/the-american-banking-system-i...

It's even further behind. I still live overseas and use a US bank account for paying taxes, etc. I'm still shocked that it costs me, my family, or someone money to send money instantly. Here when we go out to dinner with friends, someone pays the bill and we settle it with bank transfers within moments.

Europe just got an instant payment system a year or so ago and not all countries have even implemented it yet.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#418

Post by tekknik »

Dobbs wrote: post #314
cowsandmilk wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your blog article is startlingly incorrect pretty early on. Individuals can and do use ACH between each other all the time. It is literally how paper checks work in the US. And I’ve been able to use a routing number and account number to send money to someone else online via ACH for decades...

In the UK if I want to send someone money to anyone in the UK I open the mobile app and input their sort and account number, type in the amount of money and hit send. Done. Similarly in the NL if I want to send someone money to anyone in the EuroZone I open my bank app type in their IBAN type in the amount of money and hit send. Done. Back in 2017 when I lived in the US this just wasn't possible. If I wanted to send…

> In the UK if I want to send someone money to anyone in the UK I open the mobile app and input their sort and account number, type in the amount of money and hit send. Done.

Apple / Google Pay? this isn’t as complicated as you’re trying to make it out to be. get a number, find out if they’re google or apple, use the appropriate app. This has been possible for years now.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#419

Post by amykyta »

wombatmobile wrote: post #392
jimmaswell wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The complexity of this protocol seems to match its needs. I don't really get the issue. FTP and the file format come off as old-sounding but so what? Why can't this just be batched faster anyway? Improve the hardware, run the batches every 30 seconds, and it's just like instant systems? I know there must be a reason but I'm curious why it is.

When money takes time to go from A to B, who do you think gets to use the money? Yes, the banks. They are all set up to make money from your money, by lending it out at attractive overnight rates. Is that a problem? Perhaps, but you've been trained to tolerate it, because you have no choice. Multiply your money by tens of millions of bank customers, and you begin to see the size of the opportunity. Is it any wonder t…

Attractive is a stretch https://apps.newyorkfed.org/markets/autorates/SOFR, granted rates are historically low but today a bank will earn $25 overnight for every billion lent out. Not really a cash cow. Maybe that’s why there is finally some progress.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#420

Post by djbebs »

personlurking wrote: post #381
lopis wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's counter-intuitive, but if you think about it, less develop countries are in a better position to deploy fully integrated systems. E.g.: Portugal has a great, free, cross-bank, ATM system since the beginning [1] because Portuguese banks were late to the party in regards to deploying such machines. They could learn from other countries and create a more resilient system, which has since been expanded to be able to…

How’s MBpay? I loved using Multibanco when living in Portugal but I never got around to using MBpay, which I think is the equivalent to what’s being discussed for the US, essentially.

Getting worse by the moment due to EU requirements for EU-wide standardization
Post reply on HN