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Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

federalreserve.gov

361–370 of 431 posts

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just cannot understand how you guys accept bad cops, bad healthcare, bad employment rights, bad social mobility, bad education and bad banks, but apparently national id is where you draw the line. Why didn't you draw the line before all this other stuff that is far behind much of Europe? ------ can't reply directly to the GDP comment as some cry baby has flagged my post and then a free speech loving mod has shadow-…

Hold up the US has some of the highest social modility in the devolved world. (20-40% of people will end up better than their parents)

You are ranked 27th.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck convincing the shop owner to accept payment in SEPA instead of cash the next time you get a beer.

Girocard.

Is Girocard debit/credit card? If yes I don't see how that is any better compared to USA.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#364
post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nor are there floats in JSON! Json numbers are stored in decimal with varying lengths.

Yes, but almost any standard JSON package will map a number with decimals to their internal float. While alternative parsers exists (javascript has LosslessJSON for example), they're a pain to use. Using strings for floats only has a tiny overhead, but it allows users to use standard JSON parsers and it signals a good practice. If you use JSON numbers to serialize money, you create a situation where the path with the…

> While alternative parsers exists (javascript has LosslessJSON for example), they're a pain to use.

FWIW in Python that's as uncomplicated as

    json.loads('1.1', parse_float=decimal.Decimal)
though of course it helps tremendously that `decimal` is part of the stdlib.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's even further behind. I still live overseas and use a US bank account for paying taxes, etc. I'm still shocked that it costs me, my family, or someone money to send money instantly. Here when we go out to dinner with friends, someone pays the bill and we settle it with bank transfers within moments.

It's worse than that if the amount is non-trivial. Wells Fargo won't allow you to send an amount over $10k instantly without physically entering a branch.

The $10K limit is a federal regulatory requirement. You have to fill out paperwork and provide identification that is turned over to law enforcement for review.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#366
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I got downvoted for predicting this a few weeks ago.

Congrats on predicting it, but if you don't have any proof, you look exactly the same as all the crazies spreading unjustified rumors. Without proof (or at least some great reasoning), I think downvotes of "predictions" are correct.

Just need to look at all the other instances.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#367

I moved to India at the start of the year and there's the Universal Payment Interface (UPI) here that essentially allows a Venmo like interface to transfer $ instantaneously from any bank account to another - by simply using the recipient's phone number or a QR code. There are multiple apps that interface with UPI, and the barrier to entry isn't high - allowing for good competition on the UX. Literally every person I…

US banks have something mostly like this: Zelle [1]; the company behind it, Early Warning Systems, is owned by JPMorgan Chase, Bank of America, Capital One, Wells Fargo, PNC, basically every bank has a stake in it, and every bank supports it. And it works better than Cash App/Venmo; enter phone number or email address, get an instant direct bank-to-bank transfer, no fees, all from the normal bank app you'd already be using.

What we're really talking about with FedNow is not user-facing: Zelle runs on Mastercard Send/Visa Direct, but traditional bank transfers run on ACH, which is very antiquated. FedNow is supposed to replace all of this (though, who's to say if Zelle would actually use it; its possible Visa/Mastercard have stakes in it as well, and they'd lobby against it; but, even in those cases, Visa/Mastercard likely make heavy use of ACH somewhere, and they'd be using FedNow. Its all ACH all the way down)

Zelle's issue is really that most people don't know they have it. For example, Chase has had, for a very long time, QuickPay, which could be used to instantly send money to other Chase customers. Naturally, no one relied on it very often, because if I'm out for drinks with my friends, I'm not going to lead with "Hey, do you have Chase?". QuickPay now uses Zelle, so the bank doesn't matter, but people have their apps.

Its actually the exact same "problem" as WhatsApp is elsewhere in the world. Upgrades to the fundamental, platform-agnostic technologies (SMS->RCS, ACH->Zelle->FedNow) lose stickiness when people have "their app" they'd rather use. In my view, Zelle is one of the greatest tragedies in the US financial system; the banks did everything right with it, its an incredible product, but even very smart people I know refuse to use it, because its not Cash App or whatever.

[1] https://www.zellepay.com/

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#368
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue with ACH isn't the batch nature, it's that banks on both sides of the transaction are allowed a fairly long amount of time (upwards of a business day) to decide whether to accept or decline the transaction. If they decide immediately, it can go faster, but they don't have to, and many banks have no incentive to work on processing faster. They could still use a batch processing system, and just process the b…

> no incentive to work on processing faster Not sure I agree. How about the incentive to prevent customers using competing services like Venmo and others? Also the incentive to quickly receive funds into bank coffers so the bank can lend it faster. Presumably, increasing the ACH batch frequency would break something in the system or it would already have been done.

ACH is used either to get paid by an employee or to move money between accounts, neither of those things are that easy to do with Venmo, in fact zelle was created to compete with Venmo and it addresses that competition so nicely that many of my friends have moved to it.

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#369
For those in the crypto world, one real-world use case I hear sometimes is faster inter-bank settlement, in essence providing a tech solution to a (semi?) regulatory problem. Does the Fed's actions meaningfully impact your value proposition?

Re: Fed announces details of new interbank service to support instant payments

#370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not arguing with that at all! I'm saying that the fact that they aren't hasn't actually stopped anyone from using them that way. When this assumption is violated, a psuedo-identifier is assigned. I have worked with multiple systems that work this way and it is the norm in finance and was the norm in higher education until relatively recently. State government information systems also use SSN as primary identifier…

I've worked with several large healthcare organizations in a consulting capacity. You would be laughed out of a room for suggesting SSN or name and birthday as the primary identifier for an individual. All used an internal patient ID. Some had processes that would use an SSN or name and birthday as inputs to an identification procedure. These procedures would invariably include additional steps. It's perfectly reason…

The allocation of a PRN to identify patients is an explicit requirement of HIPPA which was introduced in response to the exact problems you discuss, which were common prior to the change.
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