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Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

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Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#31

Post by puranjay »

fny wrote: post #19
yes_man wrote: post #16

The problem will increasingly be "whose algorithm do we believe". Internet has revealed that people believe mostly what they want to. We have seen that a large subset of people are believing Bill Gates is behind the pandemic. Why would masses somehow be more rational in picking the most rigorous and objective neural network to recognize deepfakes, than they are in making sense of the world in general? In the end we w…

Because YouTube, Facebook will flag these videos before they become too widespread.

A video being taken down just corroborates their belief that there is some deep conspiracy behind X event

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#32

Post by hellofunk »

pornel wrote: post #26
fny wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because YouTube, Facebook will flag these videos before they become too widespread.

You're missing a sarcasm mark. But seriously: at best it's going to be a big "maybe, it depends". These services bounce between PR disasters of "complicit purveyors of propaganda" and "oppressive algorithms destroying free speech", so you can't rely on them to be on either side. As deepfakes get better, the algorithms will have worse detection rate, so it'll end with Zuck testifying to congress that Facebook doesn't…

> You're missing a sarcasm mark.

I don’t see any sarcasm there.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#33

Post by paulryanrogers »

ericlewis wrote: post #18
yes_man wrote: post #16

The problem will increasingly be "whose algorithm do we believe". Internet has revealed that people believe mostly what they want to. We have seen that a large subset of people are believing Bill Gates is behind the pandemic. Why would masses somehow be more rational in picking the most rigorous and objective neural network to recognize deepfakes, than they are in making sense of the world in general? In the end we w…

I think religion might have proved that people will believe whatever they want to first. The book Sapiens really opened my eyes to people.

Well it took me 35 years but I escaped religion despite being indoctrinated from a young age. And leaving was a difficult choice but education and evidence were the keys that freed me.

Piercing cognitive biases is hard, maybe harder if those most in need feel forced.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#34

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

ericlewis wrote: post #18
yes_man wrote: post #16

The problem will increasingly be "whose algorithm do we believe". Internet has revealed that people believe mostly what they want to. We have seen that a large subset of people are believing Bill Gates is behind the pandemic. Why would masses somehow be more rational in picking the most rigorous and objective neural network to recognize deepfakes, than they are in making sense of the world in general? In the end we w…

I think religion might have proved that people will believe whatever they want to first. The book Sapiens really opened my eyes to people.

This is on point, but we need to be clear on the direction of causality, which I believe you have correct, though I'll try to state it more clearly:

The human mind and body is predisposed for social cohesion through shared narrative, and this exposed a weakness in our psychology: we are, as groups, extraordinarily gullible.

As a result we have religion, conspiracy theories, politics, and crime.

It remains to be seen whether this is an evolutionarily fit strategy.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#35

Post by korla »

xiphias2 wrote: post #30
yes_man wrote: post #16

The problem will increasingly be "whose algorithm do we believe". Internet has revealed that people believe mostly what they want to. We have seen that a large subset of people are believing Bill Gates is behind the pandemic. Why would masses somehow be more rational in picking the most rigorous and objective neural network to recognize deepfakes, than they are in making sense of the world in general? In the end we w…

Aren't digital signatures the best solution we have for this problem? Commercial entities want to have the priviledge of being able to modify the content submitted by content creators, but the culture of trusting i.e. Twitter over client verification needs to change.

If the technology is too hard to understand for the masses it's unlikely to provide much resistance to desinformation campaigns.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#36

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #33
ericlewis wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think religion might have proved that people will believe whatever they want to first. The book Sapiens really opened my eyes to people.

Well it took me 35 years but I escaped religion despite being indoctrinated from a young age. And leaving was a difficult choice but education and evidence were the keys that freed me. Piercing cognitive biases is hard, maybe harder if those most in need feel forced.

Be kind to yourself and know that a fair swathe of the early years of life are necessarily of low agency.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#37

Post by gruez »

xiphias2 wrote: post #30
yes_man wrote: post #16

The problem will increasingly be "whose algorithm do we believe". Internet has revealed that people believe mostly what they want to. We have seen that a large subset of people are believing Bill Gates is behind the pandemic. Why would masses somehow be more rational in picking the most rigorous and objective neural network to recognize deepfakes, than they are in making sense of the world in general? In the end we w…

Aren't digital signatures the best solution we have for this problem? Commercial entities want to have the priviledge of being able to modify the content submitted by content creators, but the culture of trusting i.e. Twitter over client verification needs to change.

Digital signatures would only match of the contents match bit for bit. This means that you can't recompress/remux/resize the video. This will probably provide a very poor ux for mobile or other bandwidth limited users. Also, if the video was used as part of another video (eg. TV broadcast), you'd either have to splice the digitally signed video into your existing stream (not modifying the bits at all), or provide the digitally signed original as an appendix. In either case, you'll need tooling to make verification easy, which doesn't exist today.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#38

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

korla wrote: post #35
xiphias2 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't digital signatures the best solution we have for this problem? Commercial entities want to have the priviledge of being able to modify the content submitted by content creators, but the culture of trusting i.e. Twitter over client verification needs to change.

If the technology is too hard to understand for the masses it's unlikely to provide much resistance to desinformation campaigns.

The technology isn't hard to understand, but even if it were so what?

How many people who watch a streaming video know... anything at all about how that content is delivered, at all, at any layer.

The problem is, as OP noted, the existing gate keeps profit from being able to manipulate us, so convincing them to deliver signed content is extraordinarily unlikely.

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#39

Post by nottorp »

turblety wrote: post #2

Now we can use this new AI to train another AI that can defeat it. And so continues the great cat vs mouse chase. I don't think this is a problem that is ever going to be solved. Deep fakes will become more and more popular, and harder to detect.

Ref:

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/29579

Robert Sheckley's Watchbird

Re: Stopping deepfake news with an AI algorithm that can tell when a face doesnt fit

#40

Post by bsaul »

Maybe advanced DRMs will be a way forward ? Have camera fingerprint / sign the video, and then every editing videos fingerprint & sign the changes performed, and send everything to a ledger ? Only way to make sure a video is actually coming from the real world...
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