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.NET Team Survey: Native AOT

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71–80 of 103 posts

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#71
post #2

I’ve been a C# developer for two (almost) decades, how do people even keep up with these rapid changes in the post Core world and what/when to use them? This is a serious question by the way.

> how do people even keep up with these rapid changes in the post Core world and what/when to use them?

You wished that the dev world moved slower. Sorry, things move fast nowadays. The .NET team decided to stay relevant, by moving fast to keep up. That's just how it is.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#72
post #20
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about being able to use the language/framework you already know to compile to pure native binaries (like Rust, but with GC). It's a big deal since it makes C# viable in places where it isn't currently, like a lot of Go's use cases. I had been away from C# for nearly 6 years, but was able to pick up Core in a couple of days. If anything, things have gotten simpler and there's fairly good cross platform support…

C# has long supported it on UWP side, but now with .NET 5 there is an ongoing discussion if they will still support it or not. The whole MDIL (Windows 8/8.1) and .NET Native (Windows 10) came from WinDev, not DevDiv, hence why it has its own idiosyncratics regarding .NET support. Now with .NET 5, it seems they are gearing towards just a better NGEN, thus shipping a kind of AOT/JIT mixed mode image, which isn't being…

Interesting, they are removing WinRT support from .NET 5 CoreCLR and instead adding a system that lets the Windows team plug in the marshaling stuff:

https://github.com/dotnet/runtime/issues/35318

coreclr.dll is currently half a megabyte smaller than the 3.1 release.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#73
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've honestly given up. The new "open" development style of .NET Core is not my cup of tea. It's now riddled with MVP features that are 80% complete, bug-ridden, and undocumented other than couple of blog articles. The compatibility break with the .NET Framework also removed the biggest advantage I saw in C#, which was that any code that I wrote would "just work". Now there's more frameworks, standards, cores, and bu…

>The new "open" development style of .NET Core is not my cup of tea. It's now riddled with MVP features that are 80% complete, bug-ridden, and undocumented other than couple of blog articles. .NET Framework is a product, .NET Core is a OSS project. When .NET 5 will ship it will be even worse since .NET Framework people will just expect things to work.

> It's now riddled with MVP features that are 80% complete, bug-ridden, and undocumented other than couple of blog articles

I work full time with ASP .NET Core 3.1 projects, and I don't recognise this at all. I don't think that it's correct.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#74
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is strange that you couldn't find the empty web template. Every version of ASP.NET Core has come with one. Empty is the first option in the "Create a new ASP.NET Core web application" dialog in VS2019, and "dotnet new web" creates an empty website via the command line. What did you need to do to create an empty website? Disclaimer: I work on ASP.NET Core

The most minimalist ASP.NET Core template I could find made it too difficult to create a "page" with some code-behind. I could create a CSHTML page and inline expressions worked, but I couldn't convince it to execute anything from a matching cs class. I did google this, and it's not like I hadn't written Razor syntax pages before, but that was a few years ago and my memory was fuzzy. What I found was that Razor pages…

> The most minimalist ASP.NET Core template I could find made it too difficult to create a "page" with some code-behind.

The minimalist projects don't do "code-behind" at all.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#77
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The new "open" development style of .NET Core is not my cup of tea. It's now riddled with MVP features that are 80% complete, bug-ridden, and undocumented other than couple of blog articles. .NET Framework is a product, .NET Core is a OSS project. When .NET 5 will ship it will be even worse since .NET Framework people will just expect things to work.

> It's now riddled with MVP features that are 80% complete, bug-ridden, and undocumented other than couple of blog articles I work full time with ASP .NET Core 3.1 projects, and I don't recognise this at all. I don't think that it's correct.

Same here. Generic hateful statement from a developer that probably has spent a couple of days at most in .NET.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect a lot of people (myself included) will just stop at 4.8.

Just this week I wanted to spin up a minimalist ASP.NET page for "tyre-kicking" of new infra builds. You know, something that just coughs up a single page with some basic info, such as the regional options, time zone, current time, and the latency to the SQL Server. This checks that the infra guys did their job and that the AD accounts and firewall ports are in place. I wanted to write 1 page with just some dynamic l…

dotnet new web ?

dotnet new empty ?

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#79
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are allowed to change your mind, aren't you? :) The goal for the initial .NET Core project was to have something cross-platform, modular and lightweight to build Linux-deployable cloud-services with. Once that reached a mature state, they could expand scope. And now, after .NET Core 3.x has landed, it has matured so much, that MS can see one single unified path forward which also includes some things which previo…

The problem is it leaves all .net framework code on a dead-end platform. For all previous .net versions, code could be easily and safely upgraded to the next version because they were largely backwards compatible. But you can't easily upgrade existing code from 4.8 to 5. If you want to start a project from scratch, sure Core/5 is nice.

Business logic ports over really well - we have been able to effectively copy and paste code and the corresponding tests between a legacy .NET Framework WinForms app and .NET Core 2.0 and later service (WebAPI or gRPC) and it mostly just works. The trouble comes when the code integrates heavily with a UI stack - that’s a lot more work to port over. It was pretty hard before .NET core 2 though. But .NET 4.8 will be supported as long as Windows 10 is - probably at least another 10 years or more.

Re: .NET Team Survey: Native AOT

#80
post #2

I’ve been a C# developer for two (almost) decades, how do people even keep up with these rapid changes in the post Core world and what/when to use them? This is a serious question by the way.

another lazy "developer" who can't keep up with the newest trends. Real developers are working 365 days a year, around the clock, and don't waste time with girlfriends etc... You will never be one of them.
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