> The men were found about 190 kilometers (118 miles) from where they had set out.
Wow, that's quite a detour. Pretty lucky to get spotted so far off course.
Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
61–70 of 123 posts
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
Seriously. That’s a really extreme position to take. Saving a human’s life clearly and objectively outweighs temporarily disturbing wild animals with increased noise. Is this seriously even a debate?
Tough choices have to be made in Rescue teams all the time. Another comment pointed out above that SAR teams routinely abandon searches when it becomes too hazardous. Trading one or more human lives for another isn't worth it in many cases. We do value human life more than animals. This is non-debatable for sure. However, at some point the costs of pursuing a rescue might be outweighed by other factors - one of which…
I’ve got to compliment you. This is one of the better conversations that I’ve had online in a very long time. You’re a big part of why this has been so enjoyable. Thanks for the fun and for raising so many good points.
I was a lot more certain before I started reading you and now I’m not sure. Big respect and thanks again.
If you’re interested, here’s an absolute nightmare scenario that actually happened. People were completely unprepared for what they were walking into. It had every chance to end in tragedy, but somehow it worked out okay.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/missing-chil...
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#63Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#64Call this a freely given and viable but hard to monetize idea - this is a very tractable area for software and drones. Same with locating people in lost wilderness areas. You have a programmatic way to organize coverage areas, you have access to above-human audio and video capabilities, and it reduces the resources/time ratio that is critical in rescues. This was the tragic and avoidable story that convinced me this…
The "search" part of search and rescue is a solved problem. There's no reason to go into the wilderness without a PLB in 2020. PLBs cost around $300 [1], they have five+ year batteries, and they don't require a subscription. If you need to use it, you turn it on, it grabs a GPS lock and transmits your coordinates for about a day, during which at least one satellite will see your signal and downlinks all over the plan…
I'm not trying to take this discussion in a bad direction, but we're seeing a society-wide failure in the US to wear small pieces of cloth over our face to reduce the transmission of a serious illness. People frequently fail to prepare adequately even when given the means and opportunity. Search and rescue scenarios are not always for people that planned around getting lost and have a locator beacons on their person. I agree, if everyone had one, it would be ideal and would almost completely eliminate the need for what I described.
edit: rather than reply and extend the thread, I just wanted to say I strongly agree with you on the matter of PRBs and survival prep. I think you may have persuaded me to pick one up for day hikes.
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#65Call this a freely given and viable but hard to monetize idea - this is a very tractable area for software and drones. Same with locating people in lost wilderness areas. You have a programmatic way to organize coverage areas, you have access to above-human audio and video capabilities, and it reduces the resources/time ratio that is critical in rescues. This was the tragic and avoidable story that convinced me this…
The "search" part of search and rescue is a solved problem. There's no reason to go into the wilderness without a PLB in 2020. PLBs cost around $300 [1], they have five+ year batteries, and they don't require a subscription. If you need to use it, you turn it on, it grabs a GPS lock and transmits your coordinates for about a day, during which at least one satellite will see your signal and downlinks all over the plan…
Somehow I prefer this solution than ubiquitous drones with superior audiovisual capabilities everywhere and especially in the most remote regions of the planet.
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
The "search" part of search and rescue is a solved problem. There's no reason to go into the wilderness without a PLB in 2020. PLBs cost around $300 [1], they have five+ year batteries, and they don't require a subscription. If you need to use it, you turn it on, it grabs a GPS lock and transmits your coordinates for about a day, during which at least one satellite will see your signal and downlinks all over the plan…
I'm not trying to take this discussion in a bad direction, but we're seeing a society-wide failure in the US to wear small pieces of cloth over our face to reduce the transmission of a serious illness. People frequently fail to prepare adequately even when given the means and opportunity. Search and rescue scenarios are not always for people that planned around getting lost and have a locator beacons on their person.…
I'm trying to fight the perception that PLBs are expensive specialty gadgets meant for professional explorers [1].
They should be considered as basic and as necessary as a life vest, seat belt, or bike helmet. You should not be backpacking on the Appalachian trail without one.
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#67Call this a freely given and viable but hard to monetize idea - this is a very tractable area for software and drones. Same with locating people in lost wilderness areas. You have a programmatic way to organize coverage areas, you have access to above-human audio and video capabilities, and it reduces the resources/time ratio that is critical in rescues. This was the tragic and avoidable story that convinced me this…
This does not work well in practice, yet. There is a lot of interest already in using both off-the-shelf and more purpose-built drone technologies in search and rescue. They currently have too many limitations: they cannot navigate complex tree canopies close enough to the ground to provide reliable visual contact with subjects; their flight time is so limited that deployment and management is a real pain for large s…
I used to be an imagery analyst. You're spot on about infrared imaging. Normal dirt, rocks, and plants show more contrast than human vs environment. The only way to tell that the blur you're looking at is a person is if they start moving, and you recognize it's a human by the motion, not by the shape.
When I was an E-3, I had a three star general ask me if the image I was analyzing was a picture of a MiG-29 Fulcrum. I had to explain to him no, sir, it's a pickup truck. Probably a Hilux.
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#68What is interesting is that they set out from Puluwat[0], which was the site at which one of the pacific's last master navigators was interviewed by modern anthropologists in We: The Navigators[1]. See the Wa[2] local vessel page I co-authored to front page featured article status on Wikipedia for more details, including the amazing expanse of traditional voyaging.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poluwat [1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/758833.We_the_Navigators [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wa_(watercraft)
Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#69How often is the best earth-facing satellite imagery updated? It'd be really cool to sic handwriting recognition on it to continuously look for "SOS".
Planet are looking to offer multiple times per day. Although I think that requires the camera to be slewed and a site targeted rather than being able to cover the whole earth every single orbit. Remember that cloud cover is really common in a lot of places. The UK in January averages less than 2 hours per day of sunlight. You need enough satellites to image everywhere several times per day to allow for that. And even…
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Re: Men rescued from Pacific island after writing SOS in sand
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sentinel satellite data is open, I'm not sure if the resolution is good enough though.
At 10m resolution and ~5day revisit time, it might be possible to optimize for satellite detection. Smoke is relatively easy to spot in satellite imagery. This may be one's best bet. It's also important to note that fires (anything hot really) is also easily detectable. 30-40m high burning SOS letters would be an interesting strategy. One of the things to keep in mind is that for Sentinel-2 the mean local solar time…
It would be difficult to keep text burning for days on end. You're probably better off writing SOS in high contrast, with a regular fire nearby.