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The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

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Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#31
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was there for nearly two weeks and explored as much as I could. That was my impression. I just checked, and Singapore actually does have the lowest fertility rate in the world, by a large margin: 0.83. The notorious infertile Japan is at 1.41. I think makes a difference to the culture.

You actually need to see where people live, hdbs to see schools, playgrounds and such. The low fertility rate is common amongst developed countries. On the other hand, the government has explicit policies to encourage marrying, like not offering hdbs to single people under 35. You certainly won't see families if you don't leave the downtown area. I'm implying two weeks isn't representative of the city as a whole. The…

I stayed in a friend's apartment in an HDB and saw schools, playgrounds, and parks, which were all in use—though I'd say children were still less visible overall than in San Francisco, which is also known for having fewer children than most of the U.S.

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#32
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was there for nearly two weeks and explored as much as I could. That was my impression. I just checked, and Singapore actually does have the lowest fertility rate in the world, by a large margin: 0.83. The notorious infertile Japan is at 1.41. I think makes a difference to the culture.

You actually need to see where people live, hdbs to see schools, playgrounds and such. The low fertility rate is common amongst developed countries. On the other hand, the government has explicit policies to encourage marrying, like not offering hdbs to single people under 35. You certainly won't see families if you don't leave the downtown area. I'm implying two weeks isn't representative of the city as a whole. The…

>The low fertility rate is common amongst developed countries.

The point of the parent comment is that Singapore's fertility rate is markedly lower than other developed countries.[0]

It's beyond the common average.

In any other data set, the extreme outliers would be considered abnormal -- a fertility rate that low is not common among developed countries.

[0]: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/...

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#33
I think it's funny how the author says the people sort of go along with the government especially now just weeks after the recent election where opposition parties took a district, which sure in terms of actual governing power doesn't mean much, but means that the PAP is just starting to feel some pressure from the outside, particularly among younger people and families who opted to vote in the WP in sengkang. It doesn't really seem like sg will move beyond a one-party state soon because of it but people are hoping the government moves in a different direction especially after covid.

WP taking sengkang was big big news in sg, people have to understand the PAP has dominated singapore's government for decades. In terms of actual power it means little but it was a blow to the PAP's soft power as it was a clear sign that people want the government to reorient itself.

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#34

And for those of you that want the greatest novelist of cyberpunk, William Gibson, and his take on Singapore, "Disney Land with the Death Penalty."[1] [1] https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/

I love how Gibson compared it to Stephenson's burbclaves, which to me is like the literary equivalent of a famous musical artist singing the "Weird Al" Yankovic version of their own song (which has also been known to happen).

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#35
post #6

Singapore is a weird place. During the flight, the stewardesses walked around and handed everybody something - I was expecting a wet towel, but in fact it was a card in multiple languages which says "If you are about to bring any amount of drugs into the country, you are going to be executed." Lovely first impression to set the tone. Other than the omnipresent paranoia, the thing that struck me as the most bizarre is…

"Disneyland with the Death Penalty" (1993): https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/

Thinking about the area, haven't the majority of Far East countries since independence been effectively one-party states? Some have been "democratic", but with the same party winning the elections every time.

Singapore and South Korea could be seen as examples of successful "planned economies", but from a rightwing-authoritarian point of view with a Western-orientated politics.

(The lack of visible children is likely a result of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_planning_in_Singapo... )

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#36

And for those of you that want the greatest novelist of cyberpunk, William Gibson, and his take on Singapore, "Disney Land with the Death Penalty."[1] [1] https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/

That link is in the fourth sentence of the article.

Thought people might want the direct link with “using up your free articles” and all that.

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#37
post #18
post #6

Singapore is a weird place. During the flight, the stewardesses walked around and handed everybody something - I was expecting a wet towel, but in fact it was a card in multiple languages which says "If you are about to bring any amount of drugs into the country, you are going to be executed." Lovely first impression to set the tone. Other than the omnipresent paranoia, the thing that struck me as the most bizarre is…

I wonder, would there be an opportunity to flush any substances down the toilet, at that point? Sounds like a potentially terrifying situation, considering the number of stories I’ve heard from friends and family about accidentally flying with marijuana that they were unaware of was left over in a backpack or whatnot.

The rationale for the drug laws is interesting: when Singapore gained independence in the 1960s, it was essentially a small third-world city without much of a local economy.

Lee Kuan Yew realised that Singapore's future lay in becoming a trading city. They built a port, invested in infrastructure, and basically oriented all their policies around making the city-state as attractive as possible for foreign investment. One reason the streets were kept so orderly and well-maintained was to impress foreign visitors that Singapore was a reliable place to operate in (compare to many developing countries where the ride from the airport will pass ramshackle buildings, potholed streets, garbage everywhere, etc). They kept the British common law system because it's a good system to do business under. Etc.

They also knew that, given the region (SE Asia) is a hotbed of drug trafficking, if Singapore became a successful port then tons of drugs would pass through the city. Drugs would mean organised crime. Organised crime would mean corruption. Corruption would scare off foreign investment. Singapore could have ended up looking like most other third-world countries, only too small to retain its independence, and could easily have been reabsorbed into Malaysia or Indonesia.

The reason the drug penalties are so harsh is to scare away any possibility of drug trafficking happening there.

Just to be clear, I'm not condoning Singapore's policies. Weed is certainly not the same as heroin or crack cocaine. Harsh sentences for carrying a tiny bit of marijuana is pretty draconian. (I looked up some news articles, and it seems as though foreigners are unlikely to get the death penalty for small amounts of weed, but you can still expect jail time and caning.)

In a similar way, one rationale behind Singapore's censorship is a similar reason to the (effective) censorship many European countries have -- Singapore has some simmering ethnic tensions, and wants to prevent anyone publishing inflammatory rhetoric. (That's not the only reason, afaik, but it's one of them.)

Still: it's worth remembering that Singapore started out in an unusual position with unusual constraints. Everything they have done has been with the aim of turning themselves from a third-world to a first-world country in a few decades. They've seen many other post-colonial countries go down bad trajectories, despite said countries receiving tons of foreign aid, support from international organisations, allowing Western NGOs to operate internally, etc. So they don't have much time for Western journalists/academics/etc who push them to change their policies, because they think the policies they're being pushed to adapt would have led them to disaster.

If anyone's curious to learn more about the Singapore approach I'd point them to first look up Lee Kuan Yew's books, or interviews of him, to get an introduction to how he thought about governance and how he approached Singapore's challenges.

My own takeaway is that Singapore stands out because most other developing countries have been run so badly. It's not that Lee Kuan Yew had a brilliant political philosophy that all countries should adopt (he claimed to be skeptical of political philosophy), it's more that he was both pragmatic and took a long-range view, and put into practice many sensible policies that other developing countries could have adopted in an alternative timeline. On the other hand, that is definitely not to say that all of his policies are justifiable. I gather that Singapore is slowly changing now that they feel more secure in their first-world status, but they're still pretty averse to adopting the kinds of policies Western nations and the UN usually push other countries to adopt.

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#38
post #6

Singapore is a weird place. During the flight, the stewardesses walked around and handed everybody something - I was expecting a wet towel, but in fact it was a card in multiple languages which says "If you are about to bring any amount of drugs into the country, you are going to be executed." Lovely first impression to set the tone. Other than the omnipresent paranoia, the thing that struck me as the most bizarre is…

> Other than the omnipresent paranoia, the thing that struck me as the most bizarre is that almost nothing in the country is oriented around children. The fertility rate is basically the lowest in the world, as the way of maintaining the population seems to be simply skimming the top few percent of qualified workers from India, China, and other southeast Asian countries, people who will essentially live at the office until they have made enough money to return home, or simply retire and die alone in the country.

I've been revisiting Brave New World after watching the series on something called 'Peacock,' which honestly bares little resemblance to the plot of the book (John the Savage is less a cautionary tale of these types of Societys and more Revolutionary apparently) and the ideas of acceptable Dystopias by Huxley in his presentations at Berkely were brought up. One woman asking why only Tyrannical Governments would use these methods, and could they not also be used by so-called 'democratic' institutions for the same end. Huxley scoffs the idea as greater 'pessimism' than he holds.

The idea of being encumbered by replacement rates with fertility seems blase if you can simply import a perpetual underclass for what you cannot outsource to serve your affluent Citizen class seems like the long-term goals of any despot/regime. That would probably ensure long-standing dynasties, and political stability more than anything imaginable, as dark as that is it aptly reflects the current Human Condition. In a way I think this was the US' goal in the 21st Century as we've seen the shortage of STEM really be a Cooperate driven regression in wages (and probably working conditions) for its domestic population.

With that said, you can see what the opposite can create as Hong Kong has descended in to the most typical (accurate?) representation of a Cyberpunk Dystopia. Its entirely tragic to see, but Human resilience against all odds against a tyrannical juggernaut (China/CCP) is still something to take solace in and an archetype for a Heroism in all cultures. Even as it dissects everything unique and of value in that city-state its worth paying attention to serve as the cautionary tale of how primitive Humans still are.

For even more context (masochistic watching), consider 10 years [1] on Netflix, who recently refused to take down that and Joshua Wong's Documentary [2] on the events in Hong Kong.

1: https://www.netflix.com/title/81012294

2: https://www.netflix.com/title/80169348

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#39
post #24
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Tokyo and Osaka notably sparse compared to American cities?

In some ways, yes; in others, no. Maybe I was in the wrong parts of Tokyo/Osaka, but I do try to walk all over the place when I travel; there weren't a lot of families going out to eat, or at the malls/shopping areas, or whatever. However, you'll see train cars full of young kids going to and from school, unsupervised as far as I could tell. There are parks with play equipment all over, and I would run into kids duri…

I love how in Japan children are free to go wherever unsupervised and there is essentially an unwritten rule that adults all just keep an eye on them. And as a result children as young as 6/7 can take public transport to get to school on their own. A real mark of how safe a place is...

Re: The Fantasy and the Cyberpunk Futurism of Singapore

#40
post #15
post #6

Singapore is a weird place. During the flight, the stewardesses walked around and handed everybody something - I was expecting a wet towel, but in fact it was a card in multiple languages which says "If you are about to bring any amount of drugs into the country, you are going to be executed." Lovely first impression to set the tone. Other than the omnipresent paranoia, the thing that struck me as the most bizarre is…

> a card in multiple languages The version that I remember is this one https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/92/De... but I'm sure there are other versions sending the same message! > everything is concentrated to a district I've also noticed this in São Paulo, Brazil, which reportedly has about 60 streets with particular kinds of specialized retail. https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruas_de_com%C3%A9rci…

SP is mostly mixed used all around. Land-use and zoning pretty much doesn't exist throughout most of it sprawling and winding bairros. And it is: absolutely sprawling. crappy transport means youll find rendunancy between neighbhorhoods for most things, but each neighbhorhood does it differently.

There are indeed specialized districts in the centro for specialized products, a neighborhood for motorcyles, a neighborhood for tech, a neighborhood for oriental stuff, a neighborhood for perfume manufacturing, a neighborhood for packaging, a neighborhood for professional restaurant gear, a building for cheap wholesale counterfeiting, a neighborhood for smoking crack with thousands of othrr users, k sections of various kneighborhoods for kgetting transvestite kprostitutes, etc. K

Overall most of sao paulo is a web of somewhat self-contained microcosms. And what you find in each neighborhood is determined by the mixture and manner of demographics that frequent the place. The overlaps of these demographics makes for infinite novelty. I spent 10 years in the city and it blew by me faster than I wish it had. It is beyond a mere cyberpunk aesthetic. The vibe is unnamed.

Ive walked, biked, skated, and used public transportation through about 60-80% of the city and surrounding metropolitan area.

I left a few months ago to pursue a quiet life of naturalist adventures along the coast, but Sao Paulo was the absolute best choice for a person like me to have spent his 20s.

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