Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods • Hacker News Board

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#181

Post by lotsofpulp » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:47 AM UTC

unishark wrote: post #144

bezmenov wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A greater shock for many is the complete lack of footpaths/sidewalks virtually anywhere outside of commercial districts or inner-most metros. The idea of walking anywhere is insane. To get from a typical suburb to the nearest business district or strip mall would usually require walking several miles along the shoulder, with frequent illegal crossing of arterial roads.

This isn't my experience. I lived in a few different suburbs and there were always sidewalks. The only place I've been to where I really noticed their absence is smaller cities in New England. I always assumed it was due to the fact that the weather precluding walking so much of the time anyway. And of course in other places in the world where cities are old and streets are too small for sidewalks. Back streets in su…

It's only due to the local governments not requiring developers to build sidewalks. Most modern cities require any new or modifications to implement sidewalks.

The Northeast has a lot of old places that you will see small strips of sidewalk and then no sidewalk, and then sidewalk again. Because they force the new construction to have it, but the stuff that was already there won't.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#182

Post by nitrogen » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:47 AM UTC

AmericanChopper wrote: post #159

Spooky23 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In theory sure. In reality, the financial system is oriented towards big capital. My aunt ran a coffee shop that was established by grandparents in 1939. It was in the lobby of a office building in he central business district of our little city. The building was bought by a Chinese investor. Like other similar stores, her rent went up 5x and she shuttered. I live in a mixed use urban neighborhood. 50% of he storefro…

> Like other similar stores, her rent went up 5x and she shuttered. Want to know the best way to protect against exceedingly high prices? Increase supply. If the market had enough supply to meet its own demand, then that situation wouldn’t be possible. The number one thing that holds back the supply of real estate is insane zoning and planning regulation. The idea that permanently preserving nonsense like the “charac…

nti-social mobility, anti-equality, openly classist ideas we have in our society

But on the flip side, deciding that newcomers know better how to manage already occupied land is basically colonialism...

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#183

Post by rapnie » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:49 AM UTC

kilroy_jones wrote: post #64

hirundo wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teaching karate is a death business? In my limited experience the martial arts are overwhelmingly about defense and fitness. Making them predominantly a life business. A donut shop would be a better example of a death business.

I think they meant a business that is destined to die. Could be wrong though.

The way I read it it was referring to the type of businesses that arise in already dying residential areas, due to the rent being cheap, etc. and individuals can start their yoga studio or karate doja and such. The businesses themselves aren't bad, but they are a symptom of a neighborhood in decline. Don't know if that is true, but that's how I understood it.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#184

Post by moltar » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:52 AM UTC

Hnrobert42 wrote: post #178

moltar wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup see “shop houses” [1] in Southeast Asia for how it should be done. Shop house is a flexible creature. It can be a business, but is also easily converted into living quarters, if necessarily, or a parking garage, or whatever you want. It’s just a flexible, convertible space. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shophouse

Exactly. That’s partly why I love living in Vietnam. The neighborhoods are so vibrant and full of life. Everyone is out on the stoop. Neighbors all know each other and buy from each other. Of course, from my apartment I hear karaoke late at night, roosters early in the morning, and construction, always construction. So there are drawbacks. It would be disruptive, especially in suburbia. But I would love some middle g…

I’m in Da Nang myself at the moment :D

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#185

Post by tkgally » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:54 AM UTC

monkeypizza wrote: post #34

rland wrote: post #3

When I visited Japan, I went to an izakaya with room for maybe 9 people in it, it was smaller than my living room at home. I was hungry and I saw the sign lighting the alley about 40 yards off the main road. I was thinking at the time, if I lived in that area, you bet I'd be there a couple times a week to talk to my neighbors. I wanted to ask those inside if they were all neighbors, because they seemed to know each o…

Excellent blog about Japanese zoning: http://urbankchoze.blogspot.com/2014/04/japanese-zoning.html

That's a good reference.

In adding to zoning, there are other factors that contribute to the large number of viable tiny businesses here in Japan. One is that small shops aren't bound by as strict accessibility and fire regulations as in some other countries. A restaurant or bar, for example, that seats no more than a dozen customers and is staffed by just one or two people will often have a correspondingly tiny restroom that could not be accessed by someone in a wheelchair; the shop itself might not be wheelchair accessible, either. And often there is only one exit, the front door, even for shops on upper floors of buildings. In many cases, I suspect, adding requirements for wheelchair accessibility and a separate fire exit would increase the construction costs and unproductive floor space so much that the shop would no longer be economically viable.

I was a freelancer here for twenty years. While I didn't run a shop, I did run my business out of my home, and my impression was that it was much easier to do that in Japan—in terms of taxes, relations with neighbors, etc.—than it would have been in the United States, where I was born.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#186

Post by moltar » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 5:57 AM UTC

dbcurtis wrote: post #166

moltar wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup see “shop houses” [1] in Southeast Asia for how it should be done. Shop house is a flexible creature. It can be a business, but is also easily converted into living quarters, if necessarily, or a parking garage, or whatever you want. It’s just a flexible, convertible space. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shophouse

Interestingly, in the area of Iowa and Minnesota where I grew up, where a lot of the towns were founded just after the Civil War, the shops on main street were mostly brick storefront on the ground level, with residence above. Very few shop owners live in the apartment these days, for more than the last 50 years the apartments were rented out, usually quite cheaply. I did have one friend that ran a shop and lived abo…

I think many older North American cities have these features

Ottawa, Canada has these too on Bank St. Toronto has many of these streets also, for example Queen West. These are generally the most vibrant neighborhoods.

The solution to having lack of backyard space is to have public parks. Montreal has this more right than any other city I’ve seen.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#187

Post by AmericanChopper » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 6:02 AM UTC

nitrogen wrote: post #182

AmericanChopper wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like other similar stores, her rent went up 5x and she shuttered. Want to know the best way to protect against exceedingly high prices? Increase supply. If the market had enough supply to meet its own demand, then that situation wouldn’t be possible. The number one thing that holds back the supply of real estate is insane zoning and planning regulation. The idea that permanently preserving nonsense like the “charac…

nti-social mobility, anti-equality, openly classist ideas we have in our society But on the flip side, deciding that newcomers know better how to manage already occupied land is basically colonialism...

I hope you’re being sarcastic because otherwise this is incredibly contrived. Colonization is one country taking over the governance of another, typically without providing any representation or property rights to said nation/tribe/country/people...

Building housing to support population growth is not even remotely similar to that. Permissive zoning laws (or even better, no zoning laws) don’t even prevent existing residents from using their property their property the way they always have. The restrictive regulations are about making sure that all nearby residents also continue to use their property in a particular way. The idea that buying a house in a particular area somehow entitles you to make sure nobody else who owns a house or property in that area does anything to change it just seems completely insane to me.

A neighbour saying “you can’t build affordable housing on your property, because I like your property the way it is” sounds a lot more similar to colonialism to me.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#188

Post by jonas21 » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 6:03 AM UTC

dgellow wrote: post #163

cameldrv wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generally, I like this a lot. The key is that for it to work, you must build taller, but it doesn't have to be all that tall. I've lived in several places that had great walkability, and they all had one thing in common: They were built before the invention of the automobile. The best for walkability was Berlin, which, in the inner part, is mostly 5-6 story buildings. Within two blocks there were numerous stores and…

I’m not sure about your argument of “you have to build up”. Lot of places in Europe have strict limits regarding how high a building can be and they do have lot of small stores around, Berlin, that you mentioned, is very strict on this. A few examples: Hamburg residential areas seem to have ~4-5 floors max. Groningen has neighborhoods where apartment building are limited to only 2 floors (So just two apartments). The…

> Maybe I’m misunderstanding the US situation you’re comparing to, and people there just build flat, so even a few floors is already building up?

Yes, that's exactly the situation in most neighborhoods in the U.S. One or two story single-family homes with large setbacks on all sides.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#189

Post by alexashka » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 6:11 AM UTC

frank2 wrote: post #37

throw737 wrote: post #4

I have liquer store under my windows, it is open 24 hours and has outside benches. Basically loud nonstop pub with many junkies. I am going to move soon to get better sleep

Is this in the US or some other country?

Alcoholics hanging around liquor stores is a universal.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#190

Post by dodobirdlord » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 6:13 AM UTC

TheAdamist wrote: post #82

nitwit005 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Investors have proven willing to keep homes and apartments empty as well. The behavior seems bizarre to me, but it seems you have to set tax policies to discourage it.

If you are big enough theres some weird accounting incentive to keep it vacant. You can keep claiming it as an asset that brings in 10x dollars, even though your cash flow is 0x, so actually renting for 8x really hurts your asset value or some nonsense that im probably getting the details wrong about.

The answer is more boring than financial conspiracy. Rents are sticky and both evictions and finding new tenants are a pain in the ass. Especially for a commercial space, better to wait a while for the 10x tenant than to settle for the 8x one.