Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods • Hacker News Board

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#141

Post by bobthepanda » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:32 AM UTC

throw737 wrote: post #122

claudeganon wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m skeptical that taxes themselves can resolve the problem. The people who engage in these tactics are already quite good at gaming them. Housing would have to revert to circumstances like Japan, where homes are largely a depreciating asset.

Replace portion of income tax with simple property tax. No complicated stuff like "unoccupied property taxes and non-resident investor taxes".

Even better than property tax, land value tax.

Charging tax on property (building + land) mostly just disincentivizes more intensive buildings.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#142

Post by gotoeleven » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:35 AM UTC

pj_mukh wrote: post #112

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is people want to call it "mixed zoning" but still have Karens on the central planning committee making stupid rules, e.g. they'll have "businesses" next to "residences" but a given plot will be explicitly designated as one or the other. What you really want is the small businesses which start off being operated out of the proprietor's residence. A hair salon in a converted living room, a restaurant servi…

“Karen’s on the central planning committee” cries in San Francisco So apt.

It truly is the golden era of officious busybodies.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#143

Post by ApolloFortyNine » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:35 AM UTC

I live somewhere that has tiny businesses like this. I still end up driving to my local discount grocery store because, despite having a very well paying for the area, I just can't bring myself to spend anywhere form 30% more to even double for 'the good stuff' when I can get generics for so much less.

So sorry, guess I'm part of the problem, but I'd rather spend money on stuff I actually want.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#144

Post by unishark » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:38 AM UTC

bezmenov wrote: post #71

smoe wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never been to an US residential area and only "know" them from tv shows. Are they really pretty much completely devoid of businesses as this article indicates? No grocery / mom and pop stores, bars, restaurants, hair dressers etc.? That sounds very inconvenient. I always assumed you'd get some basic commercial everywhere.

A greater shock for many is the complete lack of footpaths/sidewalks virtually anywhere outside of commercial districts or inner-most metros. The idea of walking anywhere is insane. To get from a typical suburb to the nearest business district or strip mall would usually require walking several miles along the shoulder, with frequent illegal crossing of arterial roads.

This isn't my experience. I lived in a few different suburbs and there were always sidewalks. The only place I've been to where I really noticed their absence is smaller cities in New England. I always assumed it was due to the fact that the weather precluding walking so much of the time anyway.

And of course in other places in the world where cities are old and streets are too small for sidewalks. Back streets in such places are comparable to alleys in the US.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#145

Post by juniper_strong » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:39 AM UTC

egypturnash wrote: post #130

I currently live in New Orleans, which is very mixed-use if you're in the city proper. It's really, really nice. I bike everywhere. Groceries, bookstores, head shops, cafes, bars, hardware store (with a super nice housewares department on the second floor), plumbers, auto shops, restaurants, snoball stands, parks, schools[1], dentists, optometrists, lawyers, there's pretty much everything I need in a 20min cycling ra…

If you bike everywhere why are you going to the auto shop?

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#146

Post by ashtonkem » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:40 AM UTC

gotoeleven wrote: post #142

pj_mukh wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Karen’s on the central planning committee” cries in San Francisco So apt.

It truly is the golden era of officious busybodies.

Tangentially related, but a colleague just got their replacement of kitchen cabinets shut down by the local government for not having a permit. It’s baffling to me that the government requires that you get permission to do significant modification to the inside of your own home, especially for non structural work.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#147

Post by ashtonkem » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:41 AM UTC

nitwit005 wrote: post #49

Spooky23 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In theory sure. In reality, the financial system is oriented towards big capital. My aunt ran a coffee shop that was established by grandparents in 1939. It was in the lobby of a office building in he central business district of our little city. The building was bought by a Chinese investor. Like other similar stores, her rent went up 5x and she shuttered. I live in a mixed use urban neighborhood. 50% of he storefro…

Investors have proven willing to keep homes and apartments empty as well. The behavior seems bizarre to me, but it seems you have to set tax policies to discourage it.

It’s also related to financing reality. Commercial real estate is refinances every 10 years or so based on the expected rent. The math works out such that it’s far more reasonable to leave a unit empty with a higher rent than occupied with a lower rent, since the refinancing terms dominate the amount of lost rent.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#148

Post by y2bd » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:45 AM UTC

holler wrote: post #66

In Seattle this is prevalent, part of the charm.

Fellow Seattlite here. Seeing folks in this thread talking about grocery stores being 40+ minute walks away from grocery stores is making me sweat. I like the idea of moving somewhere cheaper, but I refuse the idea of being forced to drive everywhere.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#149

Post by jamil7 » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:47 AM UTC

ed312 wrote: post #123

digitalsushi wrote: post #77

Imagine how much better your life would be if one house on your suburban cul-de-sac was a sleepy pub. I can't tell you any of my neighbor's names. I've been here ten years. But if I could walk for 6 minutes and get a beer, we'd all know each other's names. We'd all have babysitter coverage, neighborhood watch, a reason to keep the car in the garage, and slightly bigger bellies, overnight.

Having lived in a dense suburb outside of Providence RI with a local pub just one large parking lot away, I can tell you: it sucks. Noise at all hours, drunks everywhere, broken glass, constant smell of cigarette smoke. Replace pub with "well maintained park with children's play area" and you might be on to something.

It might be a cultural thing but my home country Australia and the in the UK the local pub in smaller towns is often a much more family oriented place. Often there is outdoor seating and families go for dinner together, often there is live local music. People also go just to drink but it’s all mixed together, of course this varies depending on what part of a town or city you’re in, some are more family oriented than others. I think that kind of pub would fit well with OP’s description more than yours.

Re: Put tiny businesses back into residential neighborhoods

#150

Post by RockIslandLine » Fri, Jul 24, 2020, 4:48 AM UTC

bezmenov wrote: post #26

madamelic wrote: post #2

Mixed use zoning is just about the best case situation for everyone. - Less reliance on cars, which results in less parking, which results in less traffic... it becomes self-perpetuating. - Better walkability - Knowing your corner store clerk or at least having a rapport with them - Healthier citizens, due to them walking everywhere (Go to NYC and see how few overweight people you see... not many unless they're touri…

The issue is that the residential density of suburbia (the vast majority of Australia, Canada, NZ and the US) precludes mixed use zoning.

Meh. There's plenty of density for "a strip mall every four blocks". And you can make that structure totally walkable instead of requiring cars. The important thing is not to jack the rent through the roof.

Most suburbs don't, for no obvious reason. I did complain to the Mayor a few years ago that the grocery store four blocks from my house has only street access and no sidewalk access.

I'm not at all sure why the author seems to think that converted garages are great business incubators. That's a terrible idea. It's what my uncle did for his cabinetry business, but that's largely solo. I can't imagine wanting significant business traffic on residential streets.