Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal • Hacker News Board

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#11

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 5:05 PM UTC

anonAndOn wrote: post #8

FormFollowsFunc wrote: post #6

I pre-paid for a hotel with my debit card. The hotel cancelled the booking because of the lockdown in the UK. They refused to provide a refund, instead offering me to reschedule the booking some other time. As I was unlikely to visit that city any time soon I tried to get a chargeback through my debit card but I discovered that Government lockdowns are not covered by the Visa chargeback process.

Are you sure this was due to the chargeback process or because you used a debit card? Even vendors that have a NO REFUNDS policy can still lose credit card chargebacks because the bank will side with the customer the vast majority of the time.

[deleted]

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#12

Post by fluential » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 5:10 PM UTC

vinni2 wrote: post #4

I am getting screwed by KLM. I am guessing the Dutch government is giving similar option to KLM. my travel insurance is also screwing me saying that I should accept the voucher. It’s unfair the governments are bailing out airlines but they are just holding on to our money for the cancelled flights.

I have had cancelled overall 5 flights during this time for which I got zero response from any airline, there was no option to speak to a human as “all representatives were always busy”. All I could get is a voucher.

I’ve managed to get all refunded 3 x chargeback via credit cards and 2 x paypal. Provided basic proof of purchase. (UK)

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#13

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 5:21 PM UTC

idanman wrote: post #3

Similar issue with Aeroflot. They cancelled my flight and issued a refund but said it would take weeks. After 4 weeks called my credit card company and they issued a credit to my account immediately. The credit card company said that I could have called after a week, didn’t have to wait 4.

[deleted]

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#14

Post by wil421 » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 5:23 PM UTC

anonAndOn wrote: post #8

FormFollowsFunc wrote: post #6

I pre-paid for a hotel with my debit card. The hotel cancelled the booking because of the lockdown in the UK. They refused to provide a refund, instead offering me to reschedule the booking some other time. As I was unlikely to visit that city any time soon I tried to get a chargeback through my debit card but I discovered that Government lockdowns are not covered by the Visa chargeback process.

Are you sure this was due to the chargeback process or because you used a debit card? Even vendors that have a NO REFUNDS policy can still lose credit card chargebacks because the bank will side with the customer the vast majority of the time.

What reason do you give the bank or credit card company for the chargeback?

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#15

Post by vinni2 » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 6:26 PM UTC

fluential wrote: post #12

vinni2 wrote: post #4

I am getting screwed by KLM. I am guessing the Dutch government is giving similar option to KLM. my travel insurance is also screwing me saying that I should accept the voucher. It’s unfair the governments are bailing out airlines but they are just holding on to our money for the cancelled flights.

I have had cancelled overall 5 flights during this time for which I got zero response from any airline, there was no option to speak to a human as “all representatives were always busy”. All I could get is a voucher. I’ve managed to get all refunded 3 x chargeback via credit cards and 2 x paypal. Provided basic proof of purchase. (UK)

So you got both voucher and the refund? Or were you able to cash the voucher?

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#16

Post by mindslight » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 6:27 PM UTC

andor wrote: post #9

lowdose wrote: post #2

> Lufthansa was on the verge of bankruptcy and agreed to a €9 billion bailout from the German government. In an effort to save the company, the German government told Lufthansa that they don’t need to obey EU consumer protection law, and that they don’t need to issue refunds. It's so sad to see capitalism getting killed by bureaucrats out of self interest.

Not sure what you mean. Without government help there wouldn't be any airlines left. Would you prefer that?

Sure, why not? The airplanes, airports, pilots, flight attendants, and ground crews will still exist.

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#17

Post by anonAndOn » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 7:19 PM UTC

wil421 wrote: post #14

anonAndOn wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure this was due to the chargeback process or because you used a debit card? Even vendors that have a NO REFUNDS policy can still lose credit card chargebacks because the bank will side with the customer the vast majority of the time.

What reason do you give the bank or credit card company for the chargeback?

For a canceled hotel reservation, probably Service Not Provided.

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#18

Post by idanman » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 7:53 PM UTC

vinni2 wrote: post #5

idanman wrote: post #3

Similar issue with Aeroflot. They cancelled my flight and issued a refund but said it would take weeks. After 4 weeks called my credit card company and they issued a credit to my account immediately. The credit card company said that I could have called after a week, didn’t have to wait 4.

Is it because your credit card offered a travel insurance? Or just a dispute?

In this case a dispute.

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#19

Post by WildGreenLeave » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 8:46 PM UTC

vinni2 wrote: post #4

I am getting screwed by KLM. I am guessing the Dutch government is giving similar option to KLM. my travel insurance is also screwing me saying that I should accept the voucher. It’s unfair the governments are bailing out airlines but they are just holding on to our money for the cancelled flights.

Everyone that cancelled a flight with KLM that I know of got their money back. But seriously, cut them some slack. They are hit one of the hardest in this pandemic. The Dutch government bailing out the airline isn't a bad thing for you, it means that you won't lose the money.

Just so you know, I still haven't gotten my money from AirAsia for my flight to Seoul and although I'm irritated, I get it and I think it is fair for them to pay it out in waves. (My friend got his money back already)

Re: Screwed by Lufthansa and the German Government, Saved by PayPal

#20

Post by WildGreenLeave » Mon, Jul 20, 2020, 8:49 PM UTC

andor wrote: post #9

lowdose wrote: post #2

> Lufthansa was on the verge of bankruptcy and agreed to a €9 billion bailout from the German government. In an effort to save the company, the German government told Lufthansa that they don’t need to obey EU consumer protection law, and that they don’t need to issue refunds. It's so sad to see capitalism getting killed by bureaucrats out of self interest.

Not sure what you mean. Without government help there wouldn't be any airlines left. Would you prefer that?

I don't think this comment is entirely right, but do I stand behind the government bailouts, both for KLM, Lufthansa and Airfrance and other airlines. Why? It's simple, people can complain about Lufhansa being bailed out but not getting their money back. If the German government didn't bailout Lufthansa there would be no money to give back nor would there be any option to get a voucher because there would be no company left.